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      10-15-2017, 11:12 PM   #1
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F pace S v. M40i

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I've got an F Pace S on order which is scheduled to be delivered in Dec so I have a couple more months before I need to make a decision. I see a lot of comparisons between the SQ5 and the Macan. What do you guys think the X3 compares to the the F pace??
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      10-15-2017, 11:41 PM   #2
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Problem is, nobody really knows yet. Lucky enough we are probably only about two or three weeks away now before we can see them for ourselves.

On paper, being about half a second faster puts it on a different level than the SQ5 and Macan S as far as power/ non track use, and honesty many of us who have already ordered are going off of that, a familiarity with BMW, and a little faith that it won’t be way off from expectations.
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      10-15-2017, 11:47 PM   #3
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This will be my third BMW and first SUV; I do find the F-Pace to be attractive. I have a sense that BMWs are more reliable and better designed than Jaguars, and that German assembly quality is better than that in the UK (South Carolina? don't know). I'm sure there will be comparison tests soon.
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      10-16-2017, 12:32 AM   #4
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I wanted to like the F-pace, but the cheap quality interior put me off which is lower than the current X3. I haven’t Even mentioned The reliability issues it currently has.
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      10-16-2017, 05:06 PM   #5
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I test drove the F Pace and it handled great. What really put me off was the extremely slow nav system interface. Just entering a simple address was painful. The reports of buggy electronics with continual ongoing need for updates also gave me pause.
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      10-16-2017, 11:05 PM   #6
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yeah, when I first saw the F Pace I really wanted one. Now the novelty has worn off somewhat. The early F paces were kinda hit or miss when it came to quality issues but I'm not sure that they were any worse than any other first year production issues. The later 2017s and 2018s seems to be ok but obviously long term reliability has yet to be established. But Jaguar as a brand doesn't inspire a whole lot of confidence.

On the other hand, I've only had a single BMW (E36 M3) and it was great until about 30k miles and then there were all sorts of minor electrical issues. A good friend of mine has had an E36, 2 E46, and E90 M3s and it's been about the same for him. A lot of electrical issues after 30-40k miles and some mechanical issues. So I've never really been that impressed with BMW in terms of reliability.

So 2nd year run F Pace or 1st year production M40i in terms of reliability probably a toss up or slightly in favor of BMW. IMO, only the Japanese cars are really significantly more reliable.

F pace does handle great and the 0-60 just a smidge behind M40i. The car is for the wife so acceleration isn't that important to me. My wife is a crummy driver so I'm looking for safety and collision avoidance systems. So with this in mind, I'm thinking the X3 would be a better choice.

Last edited by dk10438; 10-16-2017 at 11:25 PM.
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      10-17-2017, 10:09 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dk10438 View Post
yeah, when I first saw the F Pace I really wanted one. Now the novelty has worn off somewhat. The early F paces were kinda hit or miss when it came to quality issues but I'm not sure that they were any worse than any other first year production issues. The later 2017s and 2018s seems to be ok but obviously long term reliability has yet to be established. But Jaguar as a brand doesn't inspire a whole lot of confidence.

On the other hand, I've only had a single BMW (E36 M3) and it was great until about 30k miles and then there were all sorts of minor electrical issues. A good friend of mine has had an E36, 2 E46, and E90 M3s and it's been about the same for him. A lot of electrical issues after 30-40k miles and some mechanical issues. So I've never really been that impressed with BMW in terms of reliability.

So 2nd year run F Pace or 1st year production M40i in terms of reliability probably a toss up or slightly in favor of BMW. IMO, only the Japanese cars are really significantly more reliable.

F pace does handle great and the 0-60 just a smidge behind M40i. The car is for the wife so acceleration isn't that important to me. My wife is a crummy driver so I'm looking for safety and collision avoidance systems. So with this in mind, I'm thinking the X3 would be a better choice.

Have you consider a Volvo XC60?
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      10-17-2017, 10:59 AM   #8
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Yeah, I actually wanted the XC60 hybrid but it didn't pass the wife test. Car's for her so no point in getting her something she doesn't like. Looked at all the usual cars, Cayenne/Macan, SQ5, XC60 and RR Velar and she didn't like any of them so it's pretty much down to F Pace or X3.
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      10-18-2017, 09:53 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dk10438 View Post
yeah, when I first saw the F Pace I really wanted one. Now the novelty has worn off somewhat. The early F paces were kinda hit or miss when it came to quality issues but I'm not sure that they were any worse than any other first year production issues. The later 2017s and 2018s seems to be ok but obviously long term reliability has yet to be established. But Jaguar as a brand doesn't inspire a whole lot of confidence.

On the other hand, I've only had a single BMW (E36 M3) and it was great until about 30k miles and then there were all sorts of minor electrical issues. A good friend of mine has had an E36, 2 E46, and E90 M3s and it's been about the same for him. A lot of electrical issues after 30-40k miles and some mechanical issues. So I've never really been that impressed with BMW in terms of reliability.

So 2nd year run F Pace or 1st year production M40i in terms of reliability probably a toss up or slightly in favor of BMW. IMO, only the Japanese cars are really significantly more reliable.

F pace does handle great and the 0-60 just a smidge behind M40i. The car is for the wife so acceleration isn't that important to me. My wife is a crummy driver so I'm looking for safety and collision avoidance systems. So with this in mind, I'm thinking the X3 would be a better choice.
I think the F Pace S looks great...maybe better than the X3 M40i.

I don't think I would take a chance on JLR reliability.

X3 M40i will be at least 1/2 sec faster to 60 MPH.

IMO, current X4 M40i handles just as well as the F Pace S.
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      11-02-2017, 04:56 PM   #10
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my wife went to see the M40i and she liked it. she thought the f pace was a little tighter but not by much. I'm going to try to go to the dealership tonight. Right now, leaning towards M40i for the following reasons

BMW slightly cheaper 66k v. approx 68 (invoice of F pace S)
M40i is a little smaller so it might be better suited for my wife who is a bad driver
CarPlay
BMW has better resale

still not convinced that BMW will be more reliable, first year run BMW v. second year run Jag.
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      11-02-2017, 05:07 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dk10438 View Post
my wife went to see the M40i and she liked it. she thought the f pace was a little tighter but not by much. I'm going to try to go to the dealership tonight. Right now, leaning towards M40i for the following reasons

BMW slightly cheaper 66k v. approx 68 (invoice of F pace S)
M40i is a little smaller so it might be better suited for my wife who is a bad driver
CarPlay
BMW has better resale

still not convinced that BMW will be more reliable, first year run BMW v. second year run Jag.
Tonight while my wife was driving home I had texted her a short, one-liner not knowing if she was driving or not. Within less than a minute I received a beautifully-typed text reply, about a paragraph long, indicating she would be home shortly but had to stop for a minute at a store, and ...

This Apple CarPlay is amazing!
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      11-02-2017, 06:21 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dk10438 View Post
my wife went to see the M40i and she liked it. she thought the f pace was a little tighter but not by much. I'm going to try to go to the dealership tonight. Right now, leaning towards M40i for the following reasons

BMW slightly cheaper 66k v. approx 68 (invoice of F pace S)
M40i is a little smaller so it might be better suited for my wife who is a bad driver
CarPlay
BMW has better resale

still not convinced that BMW will be more reliable, first year run BMW v. second year run Jag.
One other factor I had in my side by side comparison was the gas mileage on the M40i is better PLUS it has a slightly larger gas tank. Using the EPA combined mileage of 20 mpg on the F Pace times its capacity of 16.6 gallons, I would have a range of only 332 miles. For the M40i, with a combined mileage of 23 mpg and a tank that holds 17.2 gallons, my range is 396 miles. Using the highway mileage for both (if on a trip), I would have a range of 382 miles on the FPace (23 mpg) vs 464 miles on the M40i (27 mpg). That is a 16 to 18% lower range!

On top of that convenience factor, there is also of course the actual cost of gasoline. For 10,000 miles per year using a conservative cost of $2.50/gallon the cost delta is around $160/yr.
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      11-02-2017, 11:36 PM   #13
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oh yeah, forgot about that important little fact. My car gets terrible mileage and I'm so sick of going to the gas station. Even though the car is for my wife, MPG and range are important. People on the f pace forum complain about the tank being woefully small (think it's actually 16 gallons) and the S owners are getting closer to 18 MPG so it's going to spend a lot of time at the gas station. Pretty sure I'm going to get the M40i but will probably wait until December to order since I read active change assist isn't available until then and I'm hoping the steering wheel situation will be resolved by then.
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      11-03-2017, 12:02 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dk10438 View Post
oh yeah, forgot about that important little fact. My car gets terrible mileage and I'm so sick of going to the gas station. Even though the car is for my wife, MPG and range are important. People on the f pace forum complain about the tank being woefully small (think it's actually 16 gallons) and the S owners are getting closer to 18 MPG so it's going to spend a lot of time at the gas station. Pretty sure I'm going to get the M40i but will probably wait until December to order since I read active change assist isn't available until then and I'm hoping the steering wheel situation will be resolved by then.
The Ranger Rover Velar has the tiny tank too.
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      11-05-2017, 04:52 AM   #15
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I think the F Pace is still worth considering. In the right spec it looks fantastic and is different from the more mainstream Q5, X3 and GLC. However if you are buying with your head then the X3 is the more pragmatic choice.
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      11-05-2017, 07:13 AM   #16
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My dogs vetoed the F-Pace - the rear door has a fastback slope - cuts into their headroom. They preferred my E91 Touring to my current F34 and really put their feet (paws) down about another sloped cargo area. One of them asks why we can't drive the Z4 top down all year.


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      11-05-2017, 03:47 PM   #17
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FWIW, I thought about the new X3 to replace our F31 (I know, wagon to crossover, sacrilege), but I test drove a Macan GTS first and it was lights out for the competition. The few head to heads between it and the F Pace put the Porsche ahead by a few subjective points too. I still think the technology in the X3 beats all of them, and I'm sure the B58 with a piggyback will smoke, but there's no way it's going to beat the GTS in driving feel. And I feel like the F Pace edges the X3 out slightly too. That said, I've only had passenger seat time in the F Pace, and I haven't spent any time in the new X3 yet, so ymmv.
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      11-05-2017, 03:48 PM   #18
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My dogs vetoed the F-Pace - the rear door has a fastback slope - cuts into their headroom. They preferred my E91 Touring to my current F34 and really put their feet (paws) down about another sloped cargo area. One of them asks why we can't drive the Z4 top down all year.


E91 FTW!
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      11-05-2017, 04:10 PM   #19
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E91 FTW!
He did like my E91.
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      11-05-2017, 10:01 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spuntyb View Post
FWIW, I thought about the new X3 to replace our F31 (I know, wagon to crossover, sacrilege), but I test drove a Macan GTS first and it was lights out for the competition. The few head to heads between it and the F Pace put the Porsche ahead by a few subjective points too. I still think the technology in the X3 beats all of them, and I'm sure the B58 with a piggyback will smoke, but there's no way it's going to beat the GTS in driving feel. And I feel like the F Pace edges the X3 out slightly too. That said, I've only had passenger seat time in the F Pace, and I haven't spent any time in the new X3 yet, so ymmv.
You drove the X3 M40i as a comparison? Would be interested to get further thoughts.
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      11-05-2017, 11:35 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spuntyb View Post
FWIW, I thought about the new X3 to replace our F31 (I know, wagon to crossover, sacrilege), but I test drove a Macan GTS first and it was lights out for the competition. The few head to heads between it and the F Pace put the Porsche ahead by a few subjective points too. I still think the technology in the X3 beats all of them, and I'm sure the B58 with a piggyback will smoke, but there's no way it's going to beat the GTS in driving feel. And I feel like the F Pace edges the X3 out slightly too. That said, I've only had passenger seat time in the F Pace, and I haven't spent any time in the new X3 yet, so ymmv.
I'd agree, as far as handling and driving experience is concerned, I'd rate Macan > Fpace > X3.

X3 isn't bad but doesn't have the same road feel as the other two. If the car were for myself, I'd get the Macan or the Fpace but like i said, the car is for my wife so my safety is my first priority and I think the safety features are best with the BMW and it's a little smaller than the Fpace which will make it a little easier for her to handle.

Last edited by dk10438; 11-06-2017 at 01:20 AM.
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      11-06-2017, 06:54 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dk10438 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by spuntyb View Post
FWIW, I thought about the new X3 to replace our F31 (I know, wagon to crossover, sacrilege), but I test drove a Macan GTS first and it was lights out for the competition. The few head to heads between it and the F Pace put the Porsche ahead by a few subjective points too. I still think the technology in the X3 beats all of them, and I'm sure the B58 with a piggyback will smoke, but there's no way it's going to beat the GTS in driving feel. And I feel like the F Pace edges the X3 out slightly too. That said, I've only had passenger seat time in the F Pace, and I haven't spent any time in the new X3 yet, so ymmv.
I'd agree, as far as handling and driving experience is concerned, I'd rate Macan > Fpace > X3.

X3 isn't bad but doesn't have the same road feel as the other two. If the car were for myself, I'd get the Macan or the Fpace but like i said, the car is for my wife so my safety is my first priority and I think the safety features are best with the BMW and it's a little smaller than the Fpace which will make it a little easier for her to handle.
I think overall the X3 is a better choice over the F Pace if you take everything into account. It looks to be a really great car. I honestly wish the Porsche had a better user interface or better tech, but that's the price for PDK and a crossover that drives like a sedan.
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