Driver's Assistance Pkg

onthercks07 · 05-05-2021, 01:44 AM

Was wondering if anyone else agrees that the Driver's assistance package with steering assist is just not ready for release and is sometimes really dangerous?

My biggest problem with it is that the autosteer will suddenly go from green to grey and just turn off, no audible warning. And your car will just start to drift. And that doesn't show up in your HUD either meaning you have to see it in the gauge cluster.

The lane keep assist is also pretty bad - it's delayed and super aggressive and can throw you to the other side of the lane.

The stop-go cruise control works well however and accelerates nicely after stops.

Datemike · 05-05-2021, 02:33 AM

I believe the LCI will bring big improvements on this front with the SP18 hardware. The current implementation seems half baked and while even SP 18 driving assistance pro wouldn't be perfect, it'll definitely be a big step up over the current hardware.

clivem2 · 05-05-2021, 02:40 AM

Interestingly NCAP regards the BMW as being safer than Tesla Auto Pilot, the reason being is that driver attention is required. Until we have safe autonomous driving then the driver needs to be alert. I get on very well with the system, it’s just assistance and that’s what I judge it by.

Mindau · 05-05-2021, 03:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Datemike

I believe the LCI will bring big improvements on this front with the SP18 hardware. The current implementation seems half baked and while even SP 18 driving assistance pro wouldn't be perfect, it'll definitely be a big step up over the current hardware.

Hope they will make driving assist pro on X3 LCI - its removed now from many models

Datemike · 05-05-2021, 03:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mindau

Quote:

Originally Posted by Datemike

I believe the LCI will bring big improvements on this front with the SP18 hardware. The current implementation seems half baked and while even SP 18 driving assistance pro wouldn't be perfect, it'll definitely be a big step up over the current hardware.

Hope they will make driving assist pro on X3 LCI - its removed now from many models

All speculation at this point my friend. No one knows - not even the CA/SM/GMs at the dealership. The order guides should be out soon for MY22 so that should give us a hint of things to come.

titomi · 05-05-2021, 05:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clivem2

Interestingly NCAP regards the BMW as being safer than Tesla Auto Pilot, the reason being is that driver attention is required. Until we have safe autonomous driving then the driver needs to be alert. I get on very well with the system, it's just assistance and that's what I judge it by.

Fully agree. Its called assistance after all.

fndrplayer13 · 05-05-2021, 08:27 AM

I have a model 3 with enhance autopilot, as well as an X3 with DAP (well, the fake DAP that X3s used to be advertised with). Autopilot is more sophisticated, but I agree with the NCAP that it does lull me in to a false sense of security. I've had a number of "oh shit" moments with autopilot on road trips and never had one with the X3. That's because I don't trust the X3 to actually drive the car. It's just providing a little bit of steering assistance to keep me centered.

I've started to really consider whether I would even want driving assistance in a new car or not, in part because the systems are just not sophisticated enough, even on a Tesla. Yes, it keeps me from getting as tired on long road trips, but does that come at the cost of actually being less safe?

clivem2 · 05-05-2021, 10:26 AM

I would certainly spec the Driving Assistant again. As for safety as per fndrplayer13 , I confess I've used it when tired - when I absolutely should have stopped to rest. This is something to train ourselves to avoid.

For those who aren't keen on it...at least you're unlikely to have the car drive itself when you're not in the driver's seat.

satz · 05-05-2021, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onthercks07

Was wondering if anyone else agrees that the Driver's assistance package with steering assist is just not ready for release and is sometimes really dangerous?

My biggest problem with it is that the autosteer will suddenly go from green to grey and just turn off, no audible warning. And your car will just start to drift. And that doesn't show up in your HUD either meaning you have to see it in the gauge cluster.

The lane keep assist is also pretty bad - it's delayed and super aggressive and can throw you to the other side of the lane.

The stop-go cruise control works well however and accelerates nicely after stops.

Yup. agree with all your points. I've even had the 'steering assist' completely fail to follow a bend that had clear line marking on both sides, but NOT give me a warning...

I rarely use the steering assist. Love the cruise control aspect...although I wish it accelerated a little quicker from standstill.

Handynasty · 05-08-2021, 10:49 AM

Totally agree. The DAP is complete garbage. My golf is way better...

clivem2 · 05-09-2021, 06:20 AM

I was thinking about the disparity of views over DAP. My take is that it comes down to our expectations driving how we use DAP.

I don't know the design intent of BMW. Certainly, DAP wasn't positioned to me as autonomous driving or even as an equivalent to Autopilot. I've not experienced anything dangerous with DAP but I believe that's down to how I use it. Rather like Power Assisted Steering vs non-PAS, there's still work for me to do when driving the car.

With DAP enabled I still steer the car but my steering inputs are very much reduced resulting in a far more relaxing drive. I make micro-corrections rather than expecting the car to totally steer for me. It's very hard to say whether I'm using 50% or 10% of my normal steering input when DAP is operating - what I mean is that it's hard to be sure when my hands are moving the wheel or the wheel is moving my hands.

What I do know is that when I had to leave a UK motorway unexpectedly due to an accident in front of me - I took a very convenient slip road - suddenly I had to fully drive the car. I then knew for sure that I'd barely been steering the car n the motorway with DAP. Without DAP, I had to get my head and arms operating at a much higher level.

Are folks who find DAP dangerous relaxing too much and expecting DAP to self-drive totally within their lane?

allinon72 · 05-09-2021, 09:08 AM

The lane keep is an embarrassment - ping ponging all over the road, jerking you into exit ramps when the road lines disappear, sharp jolts on sweeping curves, I could go on and on. I legitimately believe if I was on the highway with a cop behind me, I'd get pulled over.

Apparently the latest software update fixes some of this but I haven't had a chance to give it a proper road test.

spangle1980 · 05-09-2021, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by allinon72

The lane keep is an embarrassment - ping ponging all over the road, jerking you into exit ramps when the road lines disappear, sharp jolts on sweeping curves, I could go on and on. I legitimately believe if I was on the highway with a cop behind me, I'd get pulled over.

Apparently the latest software update fixes some of this but I haven't had a chance to give it a proper road test.

+1 - trying it again tonight on a motorway run, I couldn't have put it better myself with the weaving and such.

05-05-2021, 01:44 AM	#1
onthercks07 New Member 26 Rep 13 Posts Drives: 2021 BMW X3 M40i Join Date: Dec 2020 Location: Bay Area, CA iTrader: (0)	Driver's Assistance Pkg - not ready for primetime? Was wondering if anyone else agrees that the Driver's assistance package with steering assist is just not ready for release and is sometimes really dangerous? My biggest problem with it is that the autosteer will suddenly go from green to grey and just turn off, no audible warning. And your car will just start to drift. And that doesn't show up in your HUD either meaning you have to see it in the gauge cluster. The lane keep assist is also pretty bad - it's delayed and super aggressive and can throw you to the other side of the lane. The stop-go cruise control works well however and accelerates nicely after stops.
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05-05-2021, 02:33 AM	#2
Datemike Second Lieutenant 109 Rep 292 Posts Drives: 2018 330e Join Date: Jan 2021 Location: Seattle iTrader: (0)	I believe the LCI will bring big improvements on this front with the SP18 hardware. The current implementation seems half baked and while even SP 18 driving assistance pro wouldn't be perfect, it'll definitely be a big step up over the current hardware.
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05-05-2021, 02:40 AM	#3
clivem2 Colonel 541 Rep 2,073 Posts Drives: X3 M40i Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: UK iTrader: (0)	Interestingly NCAP regards the BMW as being safer than Tesla Auto Pilot, the reason being is that driver attention is required. Until we have safe autonomous driving then the driver needs to be alert. I get on very well with the system, it’s just assistance and that’s what I judge it by. __________________ Current: G01 M40i Silver / Tartufo Previous: E30 318iS, E39 520i 523i 523i, E46 vert 330i 330i, E93 vert 335i, F25 30D 35D
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05-05-2021, 08:27 AM	#7
fndrplayer13 First Lieutenant 204 Rep 339 Posts Drives: 2021 X3 30e / 2018 Model 3 Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Chicago, IL iTrader: (0)	I have a model 3 with enhance autopilot, as well as an X3 with DAP (well, the fake DAP that X3s used to be advertised with). Autopilot is more sophisticated, but I agree with the NCAP that it does lull me in to a false sense of security. I've had a number of "oh shit" moments with autopilot on road trips and never had one with the X3. That's because I don't trust the X3 to actually drive the car. It's just providing a little bit of steering assistance to keep me centered. I've started to really consider whether I would even want driving assistance in a new car or not, in part because the systems are just not sophisticated enough, even on a Tesla. Yes, it keeps me from getting as tired on long road trips, but does that come at the cost of actually being less safe?
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05-05-2021, 10:26 AM	#8
clivem2 Colonel 541 Rep 2,073 Posts Drives: X3 M40i Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: UK iTrader: (0)	I would certainly spec the Driving Assistant again. As for safety as per fndrplayer13 , I confess I've used it when tired - when I absolutely should have stopped to rest. This is something to train ourselves to avoid. For those who aren't keen on it...at least you're unlikely to have the car drive itself when you're not in the driver's seat. __________________ Current: G01 M40i Silver / Tartufo Previous: E30 318iS, E39 520i 523i 523i, E46 vert 330i 330i, E93 vert 335i, F25 30D 35D
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05-08-2021, 10:49 AM	#10
Handynasty New Member 29 Rep 10 Posts Drives: Bmw m2cs Join Date: Mar 2021 Location: Pennsylvania iTrader: (0)	Totally agree. The DAP is complete garbage. My golf is way better...
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05-09-2021, 06:20 AM	#11
clivem2 Colonel 541 Rep 2,073 Posts Drives: X3 M40i Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: UK iTrader: (0)	I was thinking about the disparity of views over DAP. My take is that it comes down to our expectations driving how we use DAP. I don't know the design intent of BMW. Certainly, DAP wasn't positioned to me as autonomous driving or even as an equivalent to Autopilot. I've not experienced anything dangerous with DAP but I believe that's down to how I use it. Rather like Power Assisted Steering vs non-PAS, there's still work for me to do when driving the car. With DAP enabled I still steer the car but my steering inputs are very much reduced resulting in a far more relaxing drive. I make micro-corrections rather than expecting the car to totally steer for me. It's very hard to say whether I'm using 50% or 10% of my normal steering input when DAP is operating - what I mean is that it's hard to be sure when my hands are moving the wheel or the wheel is moving my hands. What I do know is that when I had to leave a UK motorway unexpectedly due to an accident in front of me - I took a very convenient slip road - suddenly I had to fully drive the car. I then knew for sure that I'd barely been steering the car n the motorway with DAP. Without DAP, I had to get my head and arms operating at a much higher level. Are folks who find DAP dangerous relaxing too much and expecting DAP to self-drive totally within their lane? __________________ Current: G01 M40i Silver / Tartufo Previous: E30 318iS, E39 520i 523i 523i, E46 vert 330i 330i, E93 vert 335i, F25 30D 35D
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05-09-2021, 09:08 AM	#12
allinon72 Brigadier General 4921 Rep 3,804 Posts Drives: 20' M2C, 23' X1 Join Date: May 2017 Location: Indianapolis, IN iTrader: (2)	The lane keep is an embarrassment - ping ponging all over the road, jerking you into exit ramps when the road lines disappear, sharp jolts on sweeping curves, I could go on and on. I legitimately believe if I was on the highway with a cop behind me, I'd get pulled over. Apparently the latest software update fixes some of this but I haven't had a chance to give it a proper road test.
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