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      05-20-2020, 05:34 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by freshxdough View Post
If you don't have the adaptive M suspension option then you won't be able to set comfort or sport for you suspension setting in sport individual. You would only have engine and transmission to select.
Damn it, I just checked and you are right. Bummer.

Does anybody know (for 2020 MY specifically) if the firmest in Adaptive is Firmer than standard M suspension?
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      05-20-2020, 06:15 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallsurf View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by freshxdough View Post
If you don't have the adaptive M suspension option then you won't be able to set comfort or sport for you suspension setting in sport individual. You would only have engine and transmission to select.
Damn it, I just checked and you are right. Bummer.

Does anybody know (for 2020 MY specifically) if the firmest in Adaptive is Firmer than standard M suspension?
I believe the Sport suspension on M Adaptive is the closest thing to the standard suspension on M40I. Comfort would be the biggest difference. I only use comfort mode even in Sport Individual as I feel the Sport suspension is too harsh.
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      05-20-2020, 08:08 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by freshxdough View Post
I believe the Sport suspension on M Adaptive is the closest thing to the standard suspension on M40I. Comfort would be the biggest difference. I only use comfort mode even in Sport Individual as I feel the Sport suspension is too harsh.
Ok thanks. There's no way you can retrofit/purchase M adaptive after the fact, correct?
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      05-20-2020, 09:03 PM   #26
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Can anyone comment on the ride quality in Comfort mode in an X3M40I compared to Comfort mode in an M340i with and without Adaptive suspension?
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      05-20-2020, 10:22 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallsurf View Post
Damn it, I just checked and you are right. Bummer.

Does anybody know (for 2020 MY specifically) if the firmest in Adaptive is Firmer than standard M suspension?
I have driven numerous (more than 8) X3s. Yes. The firmest Adaptive is firmer than the standard M40i suspension. I rate the the standard M40i suspension at "Sport", not "Sport+"

To your other question. Not really - upgrading after not really possible. Adaptive suspension has it's own controller and communications bus. Technically, probably, but it would be prohibitively expensive.
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      05-21-2020, 12:42 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sinbad4 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallsurf View Post
Damn it, I just checked and you are right. Bummer.

Does anybody know (for 2020 MY specifically) if the firmest in Adaptive is Firmer than standard M suspension?
I have driven numerous (more than 8) X3s. Yes. The firmest Adaptive is firmer than the standard M40i suspension. I rate the the standard M40i suspension at "Sport", not "Sport+"

To your other question. Not really - upgrading after not really possible. Adaptive suspension has it's own controller and communications bus. Technically, probably, but it would be prohibitively expensive.
Are you sure about this? What I have digged through and heard from numerous BMW tech people is that the standard msport suspension (like in the m40i/d) equals the hardest setup the m-adaptive gives you.

Secondly difference between sport and sport+ should only relate to engine and steering mapping. But maybe wrong?
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      05-21-2020, 04:01 AM   #29
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OP - What wheel size do you have? 21" or 20"? I run 20" with non-RFTs, in Sport (I have adjustable dampers) the ride is firm but still comfortable. Tweaking your tyres can make quite a difference.
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      05-21-2020, 07:20 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JensM View Post
Are you sure about this? What I have digged through and heard from numerous BMW tech people is that the standard msport suspension (like in the m40i/d) equals the hardest setup the m-adaptive gives you.

Secondly difference between sport and sport+ should only relate to engine and steering mapping. But maybe wrong?
Am I sure.. well; I thought I was. I drive the Adaptive suspension day in day out. I had a M40i with non-adaptive for a week. I don't have a scientific way to measure; but that was my strong feeling. The standard felt firm; but not as harsh as Sport+ on the Adaptive setup. Though, of course, engine, throttle response and transmission all come into play as well; but I stand by my assertion.
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      05-21-2020, 12:52 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clivem2 View Post
OP - What wheel size do you have? 21" or 20"? I run 20" with non-RFTs, in Sport (I have adjustable dampers) the ride is firm but still comfortable. Tweaking your tyres can make quite a difference.
I've got the 20" with RFTs. Do non RFTs have that much of a difference?
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      05-21-2020, 12:59 PM   #32
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Hi,
For us the “Adaptive” setting is very interesting on our X3M40i - as it is constantly adjusting stiffness based on road conditions and driving style.
It’s soft and comfortable when cruising down the motorway - but firms up nicely when you come off the motorway and go around sharp bends or roundabouts.
It allegedly used the satnav road data - so that it knows that you are approaching a bend.
It then uses this data, along with your speed and steering inputs to adjust the suspension accordingly.
Really need to get round to coding the car - so that it starts in Adaptive as standard - rather than Comfort mode!
Its easy to forget to switch it to Adaptive - as mostly the switch is used just between Comfort and Sports+.
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      05-21-2020, 01:01 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallsurf View Post
I've got the 20" with RFTs. Do non RFTs have that much of a difference?
It is hard to be sure. I had an F25 on 19 inch RFTs with adjustable dampers. The 20s with non-RFTs are considerably better but so I suspect is the suspension of the G01. There can come a point where small foibles due to RFTs grate out of all proportion. You probably aren’t at that point.
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      05-21-2020, 06:17 PM   #34
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I just test drove an X3 M4.0. I then discussed whether I should get the adaptive M suspension with the client advisor. He said the normal non adaptive suspension still adjusts according to the mode you are in, ie comfort mode softer, sport mode stiffer. But those settings are static. The adaptive suspension adjusts the stiffness in real time rather than it being static. The car I drove did not have it, and I did not notice much difference in firmness when using different modes, so I'm wondering whether he is correct. I guess it's worth getting for the price but I'd really like to know how it works.
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      05-21-2020, 09:07 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeG12 View Post
I just test drove an X3 M4.0. I then discussed whether I should get the adaptive M suspension with the client advisor. He said the normal non adaptive suspension still adjusts according to the mode you are in, ie comfort mode softer, sport mode stiffer. But those settings are static. The adaptive suspension adjusts the stiffness in real time rather than it being static. The car I drove did not have it, and I did not notice much difference in firmness when using different modes, so I'm wondering whether he is correct. I guess it's worth getting for the price but I'd really like to know how it works.
As is often the case - he did not know what he was taking about!
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      05-21-2020, 10:42 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sinbad4 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by JensM View Post
Are you sure about this? What I have digged through and heard from numerous BMW tech people is that the standard msport suspension (like in the m40i/d) equals the hardest setup the m-adaptive gives you.

Secondly difference between sport and sport+ should only relate to engine and steering mapping. But maybe wrong?
Am I sure.. well; I thought I was. I drive the Adaptive suspension day in day out. I had a M40i with non-adaptive for a week. I don't have a scientific way to measure; but that was my strong feeling. The standard felt firm; but not as harsh as Sport+ on the Adaptive setup. Though, of course, engine, throttle response and transmission all come into play as well; but I stand by my assertion.
Okay. The ones you compared with same tires, pressure etc? All can have an influence. I forgot to mention that the sport+ mapping also changes the shifting of gears; holding longer and shifts faster.

Seems very subjective and have to admit all materials from BMW do not describe very clearly
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      05-22-2020, 07:45 AM   #37
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I have the adaptive but find myself in sport individual setting all of the time but probably not for the reasons you’d expect.
My sport individual is set to comfort everything.
The only reason I use this is because I preferred to see the mph as large numbers in my instrument cluster.
When in adaptive it reverts to to standard Speedo dial and I don’t find it as intuitive to check the speed quickly.
Maybe there’s a way around this - anybody have any suggestions as it’s annoying I have the adaptive option but don’t use it purely because of the cluster settings?
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      05-22-2020, 07:09 PM   #38
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I have adaptive, but don't use it. Mainly because I'd be stuck with the 'comfort' instrument display which i don't like as much as the 'sport' display.

Also...I won't get the exhaust burbles/crackles.

And i don't want to add in another factor of 'unpredictability' like already exists with the transmission lag and other 'automated' things.
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      05-22-2020, 07:48 PM   #39
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Point of order. If you have the Adaptive M Suspension options, your suspension is always adaptive - varying and modulating the amount of dampening at each wheel / strut constantly.

Drive modes allow the drive to select different modes or themes or personalities (pick your descriptor) for your X3. Think of them as performance Targets. Sport / Comfort / Eco are the base values. Each adjusts the tuning of your steering, engine, throttle response, transmission etc. If you have the Adaptive M Suspension; then the dampening of the X3 is also adjustable. It to corresponds to a target mode.

In Comfort, for example, the ride is softer, but the Adaptive M Suspension is still in constant flux as road conditions change. It allows the suspension to instantly soften for a pot hole, then run firm again immediately afterwards.

I am going to make up numbers to illustrate the point. If a strut has a rating of 0-100 with 0 being very soft and 100 representing the firmest ride:
Comfort = target 40 (varies from 10 to 70)
Sport = target 70 (varies from 30 to 90)
Sport+ = target 80 (varies from 40 to 95)
Again, completely made up; but there will be a logic to the system that acts on an algorithm which would operate similarly.

Adaptive Drive mode is the mode with a floating target for steering, engine, throttle response, transmission and adjustable suspension. While in Adaptive Drive mode the computer watches current conditions and driver input along with recent history to determine on-the-fly which mode best represents your current driving style. It's a nice feature. With Adaptive Mode engaged, you're basically in Comfort, but will spool up to Sport if you goose the gas and start to drive in a spirited fashion. My only complaint is that it should be the default drive mode from the factory - if you have purchased the Adaptive M Suspension.
Personally; I think this is a must have option. I like it far better than the more expensive air suspension systems out there (which I find all to soft w/ too much roll). At only $700, it's the best bang for your buck of all the options. It allows you to really change your X3's personality in a fundamental way.

Heh.. I think I said most of this earlier.. but seems like some people skipped before. ;-)
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      05-23-2020, 05:54 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sinbad4 View Post
Point of order. If you have the Adaptive M Suspension options, your suspension is always adaptive - varying and modulating the amount of dampening at each wheel / strut constantly.

Drive modes allow the drive to select different modes or themes or personalities (pick your descriptor) for your X3. Think of them as performance Targets. Sport / Comfort / Eco are the base values. Each adjusts the tuning of your steering, engine, throttle response, transmission etc. If you have the Adaptive M Suspension; then the dampening of the X3 is also adjustable. It to corresponds to a target mode.

In Comfort, for example, the ride is softer, but the Adaptive M Suspension is still in constant flux as road conditions change. It allows the suspension to instantly soften for a pot hole, then run firm again immediately afterwards.

I am going to make up numbers to illustrate the point. If a strut has a rating of 0-100 with 0 being very soft and 100 representing the firmest ride:
Comfort = target 40 (varies from 10 to 70)
Sport = target 70 (varies from 30 to 90)
Sport+ = target 80 (varies from 40 to 95)
Again, completely made up; but there will be a logic to the system that acts on an algorithm which would operate similarly.

Adaptive Drive mode is the mode with a floating target for steering, engine, throttle response, transmission and adjustable suspension. While in Adaptive Drive mode the computer watches current conditions and driver input along with recent history to determine on-the-fly which mode best represents your current driving style. It's a nice feature. With Adaptive Mode engaged, you're basically in Comfort, but will spool up to Sport if you goose the gas and start to drive in a spirited fashion. My only complaint is that it should be the default drive mode from the factory - if you have purchased the Adaptive M Suspension.
Personally; I think this is a must have option. I like it far better than the more expensive air suspension systems out there (which I find all to soft w/ too much roll). At only $700, it's the best bang for your buck of all the options. It allows you to really change your X3's personality in a fundamental way.

Heh.. I think I said most of this earlier.. but seems like some people skipped before. ;-)
I don’t disagree that adaptive should be a standard setting but I have read and understood all descriptions of how it works... I prefer the fact it will change (adapt) should I decide to push on even when it’s using my preferred comfort settings generally. Basically I prefer comfort settings on our crap roads but a swift throttle response and stiffer ride when cornering and pushing on instead of additional body roll from comfort the setting.

As the other member commented I don’t like the comfort display which is why I use the sport individual setting
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      05-23-2020, 06:06 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sinbad4 View Post
Point of order. If you have the Adaptive M Suspension options, your suspension is always adaptive - varying and modulating the amount of dampening at each wheel / strut constantly.
I think some of the confusion, (not only in this thread), has been caused by BMW introducing the 'Adaptive mode'. Was bad enough in the older models, explaining the modes and what the suspension settings really meant.

There are also the debates on whether passive M-sport is 'stiffer' than adaptive M-sport, or vice versa. I say they are 'different', hard to define the stiffness of an adaptive damping map, compared to a fixed damping setting in a passive system.

I'm running an F11 wagon with the 'full fat' Adaptive Drive (VDC + ARS) suspension. I've had guys ride with me, who typically drive cars with passive sport suspensions. There is always some comment something like, "how can a car which is so comfortable, handle like this?" Firming up when necessary, is not what you instinctively expect in a softer 'feeling' chassis.

IMO, Adaptive mode makes so much sense in any vehicle with adaptive suspension. Widens the working envelope on demand, but with a feeling not what many will expect, or are used to.
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      05-24-2020, 05:57 PM   #42
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I've been looking at avail inventory around the Massachusetts area and haven't seen a single car with the Adaptive suspension. Most have Premium or Executive packages and some driver or parking assistant, but none with Adaptive. Seems amazing that people don't buy this option.
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      05-24-2020, 07:00 PM   #43
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Hi Sinbad,
respectfully, I'm not sure that description is accurate about the 'reactive' suspension aspect on our humble X3 adaptive M suspension.

I believe it's a relatively simple valving system that changes on the dampers, depending on the drive experience setting to make the damping softer or firmer. Using 'adaptive' mode just means that the valving would activate firmer/softer depending on perhaps steering angle, speed, pitch, (maybe evn navigation data?) but I don't think the system reacts to the road surface itself at each wheel. That would be like that reactive suspension that Lotus developed in the 1980s/1990s that I used to dream of having on a car... But our relatively low cost adaptive suspension option is probably not that sophisticated. I believe it might work like that on the more top-end BMWs?

Couldn't find anything about it in the Technical Training Manuals.

Happy to stand corrected!
cheers

Quote:
Originally Posted by sinbad4 View Post
Point of order. If you have the Adaptive M Suspension options, your suspension is always adaptive - varying and modulating the amount of dampening at each wheel / strut constantly.

Drive modes allow the drive to select different modes or themes or personalities (pick your descriptor) for your X3. Think of them as performance Targets. Sport / Comfort / Eco are the base values. Each adjusts the tuning of your steering, engine, throttle response, transmission etc. If you have the Adaptive M Suspension; then the dampening of the X3 is also adjustable. It to corresponds to a target mode.

In Comfort, for example, the ride is softer, but the Adaptive M Suspension is still in constant flux as road conditions change. It allows the suspension to instantly soften for a pot hole, then run firm again immediately afterwards.

I am going to make up numbers to illustrate the point. If a strut has a rating of 0-100 with 0 being very soft and 100 representing the firmest ride:
Comfort = target 40 (varies from 10 to 70)
Sport = target 70 (varies from 30 to 90)
Sport+ = target 80 (varies from 40 to 95)
Again, completely made up; but there will be a logic to the system that acts on an algorithm which would operate similarly.

Adaptive Drive mode is the mode with a floating target for steering, engine, throttle response, transmission and adjustable suspension. While in Adaptive Drive mode the computer watches current conditions and driver input along with recent history to determine on-the-fly which mode best represents your current driving style. It's a nice feature. With Adaptive Mode engaged, you're basically in Comfort, but will spool up to Sport if you goose the gas and start to drive in a spirited fashion. My only complaint is that it should be the default drive mode from the factory - if you have purchased the Adaptive M Suspension.
Personally; I think this is a must have option. I like it far better than the more expensive air suspension systems out there (which I find all to soft w/ too much roll). At only $700, it's the best bang for your buck of all the options. It allows you to really change your X3's personality in a fundamental way.

Heh.. I think I said most of this earlier.. but seems like some people skipped before. ;-)
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      05-24-2020, 11:16 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by satz View Post
Hi Sinbad,
respectfully, I'm not sure that description is accurate about the 'reactive' suspension aspect on our humble X3 adaptive M suspension.

I believe it's a relatively simple valving system that changes on the dampers, depending on the drive experience setting to make the damping softer or firmer. Using 'adaptive' mode just means that the valving would activate firmer/softer depending on perhaps steering angle, speed, pitch, (maybe evn navigation data?) but I don't think the system reacts to the road surface itself at each wheel. That would be like that reactive suspension that Lotus developed in the 1980s/1990s that I used to dream of having on a car... But our relatively low cost adaptive suspension option is probably not that sophisticated. I believe it might work like that on the more top-end BMWs?

Couldn't find anything about it in the Technical Training Manuals.

Happy to stand corrected!
cheers
No worries. It's not explained from BMW very well.

Adjustable shocks used to work off a manual dial where you will literally dial in the firmness of the strut to meet your preferred stiffness.

BMW Adaptive M Suspension doesn't just do this electronically - that is, it doesn't simply set soft, firm, firmest like the old adjustable suspensions. There's a lot more going on. Many sensors, it's own bus, computer module dedicated to constantly assess and make micro adjustments - within a few milliseconds.

I notice this best when taking a cloverleaf on uneven pavement, the tires just stay glued to the road. Very, very nice.

Here's some various sources with more info:

This explains how it modifies on-the-fly to hold the road:


This Youtuber explains pretty well. Posting @ part where he discusses BMW:


This guys writes a good explanation:
https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=942225

From Jalopnik:
https://jalopnik.com/the-engineering...ing-1830257906
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