[georgere]

In short, Mercedes is the best. I'd take macan if I was in the market though. Also that jaguar got good reviews.

[damnitBobby]

They need to include the SQ5.

We know it isn't the fastest in a straight line but I don't think Audi was gunning for that title. It definitely has competitive road holding and brake distance numbers. Not to mention cabin quietness, good observed MPG, tech, interior quality... pretty much all the important stuff that the average consumer is looking for.

Kudos to BMW though that is an impressive quarter mile time! Can't wait to see what kind of numbers the X3 M will put down!

[bwcooper]

Originally Posted by damnitBobby

They need to include the SQ5.

You probably know this, but you can get the comparable SQ5 numbers by going to the Car and Driver site and looking up a different comparison. Agree it would have made sense to include it on this one though.

[mspringer]

https://www.caranddriver.com/compari...omparison-test

These C&D 'comparison' tests are basically a compendium of the individual tests they've done on the cars. The M40 numbers given in the Velar review indicate C&D is about to publish their test on M40.

Before people read too much into the handling numbers take a look at the tires on the different vehicles used for the tests. The AMG GLC43 had Max performance summer tires, the Audi had SUV summer tires which weren't max performance, and until C&D publishes the M40 review we won't know what tires were on it. And the differences in tires can account for much or all of the differences in handling numbers

[96_Impreza]

1st world is where it's at - why be anywhere else?

[Salespunk]

I bought an M40i last week and can give some color here. From a background perspective, I have never owned an X3 before and refused to even sit in the previous gen. My most recent cars have been an M4, M5, 750 and E90 M3 6spd along with an '85 911 and these were my comparison basis. We cross shopped the GLC 43, new Discovery, M3 etc. Long story behind why the diversity, but that is for another day.

My test drive was about 20 minutes back to back with the M3 and I had driven the GLC the same day. The loop was some tight and rough back roads with decent elevation changes through out. One of the better options for a test drive locally that also contained some freeway cruising as well. My truck has the 21" option with Bridgestone Alenza tires. I did not even pay attention to whether they are the AS or Summer option to be honest, but I assume they are the AS tires.

On to the drives, the M3 was very similar to my previous M4 obviously. I did not have the Comp pack which this car had and I was excited to try it after hearing so many good things about it. I found the steering feel to be disappointing as I was expecting a bigger improvement. Power was obviously very good and the car changes direction if you merely think about it. I also found the ride to be more compliant than my M4, but the car still skips in rough corners. It finds grip again quickly, but it can be unsettling if you are not used to it.

The GLC was not on the same test loop and once I saw the interior it was not a serious contender. As I stated before it feels like an 80's German car, very dark and cocoon like inside. Not better or worse just different and not my wife's preference (this is her daily driver). It does have great power, similar to the X3 and handles well. I was not pushing hard on the test drive since I did not know the salesperson and I try to be respectful in those situations. Definitely a nice vehicle and worthy competitor, but I did not find much difference from the X3 dynamically. Ride was decent as well without any harshness in my limited experience.

On to the X3 which we ultimately bought. First off the interior is next level compared to the other vehicles. It is a very open and airy space, great seats (unlike the new sport seats in the 5 series) and a great place to spend significant amounts of time. My only complaint for the interior is the amount of distance between the window sill and arm rest. Sounds weird, but they are so far apart that I have trouble finding a place to comfortably rest my left arm. Small complaint, but I noticed it almost immediately. As for power, it is more than adequate. It is as quick as my son's 340i and lots of fun even during the break in period. I thought my M4 was a very good power balance so the upcoming X3M will be even better I'm sure, but also understand that I thought my M5 was over powered for the chassis (in general the M5 was a big let down for me). I found the handling of the X3 to be very fun and easily accessible. It found grip in the corners where the M3 was skipping. The M3 was still faster, but it was always on edge as well so you feel like you have to be on alert. The X3 M40i allows mortals to switch between having some back road fun and cruising the freeways to work with ease without feeling like you are giving up much in either direction. It is great balance of performance and livability.

BTW I forgot to mention that we also looked at an X5 briefly. Going from the X3 to the X5 you can instantly tell the X5 is an older product. The X5 definitely leans more towards luxury and makes for a great highway cruiser. In comparison to the X3 it feels a little ponderous and you don't really gain any interior space. The back seat room would have swung it to the X5 if we could have comfortably gotten two mid sized adults in the back seat along with our daughter's booster (we have 5 kids and 4 are teenagers).

Let me know if you have any specific questions, I will be happy to answer them the best I can.

[Slalom]

Salespunk, Thank you for the comprehensive review.

[marcva]

Originally Posted by epiphone3

Are we really celebrating the superior fuel economy in a performance SUV category when the Mercedes beat us in performance?

Pains me to see this given I've been a BMW fan for 33 years.

Didn't that horse leave your barn when you started talking about trucks?

[stylinexpat]

Originally Posted by spuntyb

Yup. As I said, until I can drive it, I don't really know. I think the GTS and M40i are well matched in many ways, and if you're just looking for a fun grocery getter/family hauler with excellent technology, the M40i is probably tough to beat. I certainly wouldn't pick the base Macan or Macan S over it. I'd only give the GTS the edge in terms of the transmission, sound, and interior quality. It was a bank vault on the highway, and I just can't imagine an X3 with that kind of fit and finish, but maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised when I get behind the wheel? Who knows, maybe I'll be in an M40i in a few years!

I have the Macan GTS, great interior and great handling. Even better are the brakes on the GTS. Literally stops on a dime. Only bad part to the GTS is the fuel economy. It really does guzzle fuel

[Max Well]

Originally Posted by Salespunk

I bought an M40i last week and can give some color here. From a background perspective, I have never owned an X3 before and refused to even sit in the previous gen. My most recent cars have been an M4, M5, 750 and E90 M3 6spd along with an '85 911 and these were my comparison basis. We cross shopped the GLC 43, new Discovery, M3 etc. Long story behind why the diversity, but that is for another day. ...

On to the X3 which we ultimately bought. First off the interior is next level compared to the other vehicles. It is a very open and airy space, great seats (unlike the new sport seats in the 5 series) and a great place to spend significant amounts of time. My only complaint for the interior is the amount of distance between the window sill and arm rest. Sounds weird, but they are so far apart that I have trouble finding a place to comfortably rest my left arm. Small complaint, but I noticed it almost immediately. As for power, it is more than adequate. It is as quick as my son's 340i and lots of fun even during the break in period. I thought my M4 was a very good power balance so the upcoming X3M will be even better I'm sure, but also understand that I thought my M5 was over powered for the chassis (in general the M5 was a big let down for me). I found the handling of the X3 to be very fun and easily accessible. It found grip in the corners where the M3 was skipping. The M3 was still faster, but it was always on edge as well so you feel like you have to be on alert. The X3 M40i allows mortals to switch between having some back road fun and cruising the freeways to work with ease without feeling like you are giving up much in either direction. It is great balance of performance and livability. ...

An excellent review written in objective fashion with appropriate subjective commentary based on actual experience with the vehicle - well done.

[spuntyb]

Originally Posted by stylinexpat

I have the Macan GTS, great interior and great handling. Even better are the brakes on the GTS. Literally stops on a dime. Only bad part to the GTS is the fuel economy. It really does guzzle fuel

Thankfully it has the larger tank, but yeah, most of the folks on the forums say it guzzles gas like there's no tomorrow. The fact they put the larger Turbo brakes on there is nice, and the stopping power was unexpected. Overall, I was really blown away by the whole package. I wanted to hate it because we're replacing our beloved F31 and didn't want a crossover, but damn it's a *crazy good* crossover. Not sure how they did it.

[hi_officer]

Why not use the Macan GTS in the test with 360hp? It seems it would be the most comparable to the quasi-M and quasi-AMG models. The Macan Turbo would then be comparable to the real M and AMG.

[spuntyb]

Originally Posted by hi_officer

Why not use the Macan GTS in the test with 360hp? It seems it would be the most comparable to the quasi-M and quasi-AMG models. The Macan Turbo would then be comparable to the real M and AMG.

I wondered the same.

I'm looking forward to driving the M40i myself or seeing more head to heads between it and the GTS. I think that's the better comparison here.

[ND40oz]

Originally Posted by hi_officer

Why not use the Macan GTS in the test with 360hp? It seems it would be the most comparable to the quasi-M and quasi-AMG models. The Macan Turbo would then be comparable to the real M and AMG.

It's a review for the Velar, so it appears they picked vehicles they think will be cross-shopped with it.

[kozzi]

How can anyone possibly hate? At this price point and segment, the performance is awesome and long over due. Counting the days until I am in mine!

[spuntyb]

Originally Posted by ND40oz

It's a review for the Velar, so it appears they picked vehicles they think will be cross-shopped with it.

I figured the same. The Macan S is incredibly popular, while the GTS is a bit of a rarity and probably not cross shopped as much in this segment.

[sor]

Originally Posted by spuntyb

I figured the same. The Macan S is incredibly popular, while the GTS is a bit of a rarity and probably not cross shopped as much in this segment.

I was actually surprised, the local dealer only had one GTS, and it was fairly loaded at $105k. They had many Macan S but the least expensive was loaded to $85k. From the “starting at” numbers you’d think they’re at least in the ballpark of these competitors, but apparently you have to order one (which also takes a lot longer than I’m used to with BMW, quoted over 6 months).

[spuntyb]

Originally Posted by sor

I was actually surprised, the local dealer only had one GTS, and it was fairly loaded at $105k. They had many Macan S but the least expensive was loaded to $85k. From the “starting at” numbers you’d think they’re at least in the ballpark of these competitors, but apparently you have to order one (which also takes a lot longer than I’m used to with BMW, quoted over 6 months).

Whoa! That's silly $ for an S or GTS. They had a perfect GTS on the lot that I test drove for about $86k and I almost bought it on the spot, but we ordered ours because we were picky about colors. Total wait will only be 3 months. Still longer than BMW. Amazed they said 6 months, damn

[sor]

Originally Posted by spuntyb

Whoa! That's silly $ for an S or GTS. They had a perfect GTS on the lot that I test drove for about $86k and I almost bought it on the spot, but we ordered ours because we were picky about colors. Total wait will only be 3 months. Still longer than BMW. Amazed they said 6 months, damn

Multiple Audi dealers have quoted me 6 mo as well for custom builds over the years. Maybe they're just trying to talk me into what's on the lot.

Damn, looks like that high end GTS sold. It's been a few months, now I see they have four GTS between $85-95k and two S in the $75k range. The thing is, I know I'd want to load it up with options and the Macan just gets too rich compared to the competition.

[spuntyb]

Originally Posted by sor

Multiple Audi dealers have quoted me 6 mo as well for custom builds over the years. Maybe they're just trying to talk me into what's on the lot.

Damn, looks like that high end GTS sold. It's been a few months, now I see they have four GTS between $85-95k and two S in the $75k range. The thing is, I know I'd want to load it up with options and the Macan just gets too rich compared to the competition.

Depends what options you want. I spent months researching the options on the forums, and I really can't understand a GTS over $85k. Ours was about $85k MSRP and had everything but the Burmester system and the CCBs (performance-wise). That's still pricey I know, but we also have the full leather interior on top of all the other goodies.

[MichiganMike]

Originally Posted by bwcooper

You probably know this, but you can get the comparable SQ5 numbers by going to the Car and Driver site and looking up a different comparison. Agree it would have made sense to include it on this one though.

Below is a link to a recent test of the Audi SQ5 by Car and Driver.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...q5-test-review

[sor]

Originally Posted by spuntyb

Depends what options you want. I spent months researching the options on the forums, and I really can't understand a GTS over $85k. Ours was about $85k MSRP and had everything but the Burmester system and the CCBs (performance-wise). That's still pricey I know, but we also have the full leather interior on top of all the other goodies.

I do agree, that's just all that was available at the time. I might have been able to get a transfer if I'd have gotten really serious about it.

These links won't age well, but here are some examples ~$100k+ GTS builds if you're curious as to how it could get there. They really aren't that common, perhaps I just had bad luck.

https://goo.gl/gfxccY
https://goo.gl/dTAAwg