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      11-13-2019, 09:30 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
SUV on a race track, is like a someone on a diet choosing a low calorie donut. 🍩

If you want to do that, make the right choices...
:
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      11-13-2019, 11:32 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by ParadigmDawg View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
SUV on a race track, is like a someone on a diet choosing a low calorie donut. 🍩

If you want to do that, make the right choices...
Besides the GLC63S and possibly the X3MC is faster at Nurburgring than both of your "sports cars"...
Is that so? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 besides, I don't own any "sports cars", sporty maybe, but not proper sports cars.

Would love to see Sport Auto's times for the M3 C and the C63S T, but they haven't tested them. M4, M4CS and C63S coupe yes. The vanilla M4 was 7:52, the E46 M3 7:50 (on cup 2's and the C63S 7:44. BMW's time for the M3 CS was 7:38 (SA was 7:42 for the M4 CS) whilst the GLC63S was 7:49.37. You can speculate what the M3 comp time would be if you want, maybe the mid point between the M4 time and CS time at 7:45 to 7:48? Personally, I would expect it to be better or equal to the C63S coupe, but a second or so over a 12 miles circuit isn't much.

I am not saying the X3MC is slow - it can't be with 510ps but it is not a typical car that gets taken to track days. I think the new M3 will put in a good time however and demonstrate the difference that the higher CoG of the X3MC makes, which is my point really.

Let's meet over at the 'Ring next year when the weather improves. I will bring my C63S T and you your X3MC or GLC63S and we can compare and after, I will buy you a beer.
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      11-13-2019, 11:33 PM   #25
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      11-13-2019, 11:58 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by AlexFL View Post
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Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
SUV on a race track, is like a someone on a diet choosing a low calorie donut. 🍩

If you want to do that, make the right choices...
this video is for ya...

Sorry to have to point out that that is a drag strip and not a race track.
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      11-14-2019, 06:27 AM   #27
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Camaro power 455 and 0-60 4.1?? BM is pleny power going by that video
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      11-14-2019, 07:56 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by M5 TT View Post
Camaro power 455 and 0-60 4.1?? BM is pleny power going by that video
Stock X3MC is 550 hp and 3.3 sec 0-60. So yeah... no chance for that Camaro SS.
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      11-14-2019, 08:02 AM   #29
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got to say I find 3.3 hard to believe, Hope I am proved wrong. i have a draggy but cant launch until 3k miles according to owners manual
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      11-14-2019, 08:03 AM   #30
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For me, the most interesting part of the video is watching the paddle shift difference between the Stelvio and the X3M

The Stelvio, like the Quattroformaggio, has steering column mounted paddles. I remember when the cars came out, idiots all over the world rejoiced about how wonderful column mounted paddles. Meanwhile, people who actually drive were thinking 'but then how do I shift while turning?'

Well the video proves that indeed, column mounted paddles are for hard parkers and village idiots only. The Stelvio driver has to take his hand off the steering wheel multiple times to shift gears. So stupid.

Fortunately BMW has not succumbed -yet- to doing such stupid things. They put their paddles on the steering wheel where they belong.
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      11-14-2019, 08:05 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by ///M TOWN View Post
🔥

X3M is a little beast

Surprised the Alfa didn't go into limp mode
It probably did and they had to reset it multiple times to get it to function for the video

It's pretty interesting to hear people actually consider Alfas to be vehicles. To be a vehicle you need to function.
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      11-14-2019, 08:35 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
Is that so? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 besides, I don't own any "sports cars", sporty maybe, but not proper sports cars.

Would love to see Sport Auto's times for the M3 C and the C63S T, but they haven't tested them. M4, M4CS and C63S coupe yes. The vanilla M4 was 7:52, the E46 M3 7:50 (on cup 2's and the C63S 7:44. BMW's time for the M3 CS was 7:38 (SA was 7:42 for the M4 CS) whilst the GLC63S was 7:49.37. You can speculate what the M3 comp time would be if you want, maybe the mid point between the M4 time and CS time at 7:45 to 7:48? Personally, I would expect it to be better or equal to the C63S coupe, but a second or so over a 12 miles circuit isn't much.

I am not saying the X3MC is slow - it can't be with 510ps but it is not a typical car that gets taken to track days. I think the new M3 will put in a good time however and demonstrate the difference that the higher CoG of the X3MC makes, which is my point really.

Let's meet over at the 'Ring next year when the weather improves. I will bring my C63S T and you your X3MC or GLC63S and we can compare and after, I will buy you a beer.
I think you just proved that your statement of "SUV on a race track, is like a someone on a diet choosing a low calorie donut" is just silly.

Although I like beer, The Ring is a little too far from Texas for me to go just to have one.
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      11-14-2019, 09:42 AM   #33
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Is everyone here just for bragging rights?

First there is the inevitable stupid "SUVs don't belong on race tracks, but my four-door sedan with heated seats, 35-speaker sound system, 400 lbs of sound insulation, and acres of leather is a perfectly appropriate track car" claim. A tiny number of you ever will take your cars to a race track. And of that tiny number, a much tinier percentage will dedicate the time, effort and money to develop the driving skills necessary to drive any of these cars more aggressively than 7/10s without stuffing them into a tire wall (i.e., anywhere near the limit where the small marginal differences between these highly capable machines can become evident). Not to mention that anyone who is in any way serious about race track use will realize quickly that neither the X3M, nor the M3, nor any other street car is appropriate due to the severe compromises in safety.

Then there is the "My choice of the X3MC is vindicated because it is .1 seconds faster to 60 than a Competitor Y (never mind that I likely will never actually race Competitor Y and the impressively low acceleration figure requires launch control)".

For all the bench racing, chest-beating and minute dissection of quarter-mile times (sometimes even resulting not from actual quarter-mile times but from spreadsheet calculations and extrapolations), there is surprisingly little discussion about the real world every day use of these machines. I've done the race track thing, including instructing and wheel-to-wheel racing in a dedicated and properly equipped race car. With respect to a street car, I care much more about how it functions in every day use, whether it brings a smile to my face when I see it, when I start it, and when I drive it, how responsive is it on my daily drive to work, how comfortable it is after a day-long highway slog, etc. I cannot imagine making a $90,000 purchase decision based on whether the car I choose would beat some other car in a mythical 0-to-whatever race that will never happen. Maybe I am just an outlier here.
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      11-14-2019, 09:47 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M5 TT View Post
got to say I find 3.3 hard to believe, Hope I am proved wrong. i have a draggy but cant launch until 3k miles according to owners manual
3.3 has been confirmed by some people here and also C&D
https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...mw-x3-m-drive/
This value should not surprise you, it's on the same level with GLC63S and Stelvio QV. X3MC is slightly heavier but seems to have more hp. Also the two competitors have significantly wider tires that slow down the car a bit.
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      11-14-2019, 10:09 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by MRichmond View Post
Is everyone here just for bragging rights?

First there is the inevitable stupid "SUVs don't belong on race tracks, but my four-door sedan with heated seats, 35-speaker sound system, 400 lbs of sound insulation, and acres of leather is a perfectly appropriate track car" claim. A tiny number of you ever will take your cars to a race track. And of that tiny number, a much tinier percentage will dedicate the time, effort and money to develop the driving skills necessary to drive any of these cars more aggressively than 7/10s without stuffing them into a tire wall (i.e., anywhere near the limit where the small marginal differences between these highly capable machines can become evident). Not to mention that anyone who is in any way serious about race track use will realize quickly that neither the X3M, nor the M3, nor any other street car is appropriate due to the severe compromises in safety.

Then there is the "My choice of the X3MC is vindicated because it is .1 seconds faster to 60 than a Competitor Y (never mind that I likely will never actually race Competitor Y and the impressively low acceleration figure requires launch control)".

For all the bench racing, chest-beating and minute dissection of quarter-mile times (sometimes even resulting not from actual quarter-mile times but from spreadsheet calculations and extrapolations), there is surprisingly little discussion about the real world every day use of these machines. I've done the race track thing, including instructing and wheel-to-wheel racing in a dedicated and properly equipped race car. With respect to a street car, I care much more about how it functions in every day use, whether it brings a smile to my face when I see it, when I start it, and when I drive it, how responsive is it on my daily drive to work, how comfortable it is after a day-long highway slog, etc. I cannot imagine making a $90,000 purchase decision based on whether the car I choose would beat some other car in a mythical 0-to-whatever race that will never happen. Maybe I am just an outlier here.
You are on an enthusiast forum and at discussing one of the top SUVs...what do you expect?

For me a 0-60 run happens every single day and it is an important aspect to me as is the sound and the looks. I have several of the "0-to-whatever" races in it and is likely looking for more today. Just because you don't do it doesn't mean it is "mythical".

It's also my daily driver and my office since I am in sales. Most of my colleagues purchase inexpensive gas efficient cars for work but if I am going to spend most of my day in a car, it's going to be a car I love being in. Long haul comfort is something I need to and that is the main reason I sold my M40.

The chest-beating on this forum is the reason I like it. Heck...I don't even own a BMW....
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      11-14-2019, 10:34 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ParadigmDawg View Post
For me a 0-60 run happens every single day and it is an important aspect to me as is the sound and the looks. I have several of the "0-to-whatever" races in it and is likely looking for more today. Just because you don't do it doesn't mean it is "mythical".
Really? You run across X3Ms, Macan Turbos, Stelvios and Jag SVRs (or fairly rare sedans or coupes of similar abilities) every single day who want to line up at a red light and race you to 60 or 100? Ok, ok.
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      11-14-2019, 10:38 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ParadigmDawg View Post
You are on an enthusiast forum and at discussing one of the top SUVs...what do you expect?

For me a 0-60 run happens every single day and it is an important aspect to me as is the sound and the looks. I have several of the "0-to-whatever" races in it and is likely looking for more today. Just because you don't do it doesn't mean it is "mythical".

It's also my daily driver and my office since I am in sales. Most of my colleagues purchase inexpensive gas efficient cars for work but if I am going to spend most of my day in a car, it's going to be a car I love being in. Long haul comfort is something I need to and that is the main reason I sold my M40.

The chest-beating on this forum is the reason I like it. Heck...I don't even own a BMW....
That's exactly right, Dawg! My wife forced me to sell my Stage II M4 after it brought me into speeding trouble. I bought an X3 M40i and then switched to X3 MC. I must say that my X3 MC drives and feels more like a stock M3/M4 rather than an X3. People don't realize that this car per se is not an SUV. It's basically the new M3 with an SUV body.
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      11-14-2019, 11:04 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by MRichmond View Post
Really? You run across X3Ms, Macan Turbos, Stelvios and Jag SVRs (or fairly rare sedans or coupes of similar abilities) every single day who want to line up at a red light and race you to 60 or 100? Ok, ok.
I didn't say that at all. I run 0-60's or other variations to log data on my Dragy mainly alone.

As far as street racing other cars, it is always the Corvettes, Mustangs, Dodges and a few Bimmers that always want to give it a go.

That being said, none of the cars you mentioned are scarce around me. Our 'nights out' are always down the street from where we live that has several high end restaurants in one area. My AMG is on the low end of what cars you see there. It's not unusual to see Ferraris, McLarens, GT2 AND 3's and some Lambos down there on any given night. All old man from old money that likely can't even drive.
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      11-14-2019, 12:22 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by MRichmond View Post
Is everyone here just for bragging rights?

First there is the inevitable stupid "SUVs don't belong on race tracks, but my four-door sedan with heated seats, 35-speaker sound system, 400 lbs of sound insulation, and acres of leather is a perfectly appropriate track car" claim. A tiny number of you ever will take your cars to a race track. And of that tiny number, a much tinier percentage will dedicate the time, effort and money to develop the driving skills necessary to drive any of these cars more aggressively than 7/10s without stuffing them into a tire wall (i.e., anywhere near the limit where the small marginal differences between these highly capable machines can become evident). Not to mention that anyone who is in any way serious about race track use will realize quickly that neither the X3M, nor the M3, nor any other street car is appropriate due to the severe compromises in safety.

Then there is the "My choice of the X3MC is vindicated because it is .1 seconds faster to 60 than a Competitor Y (never mind that I likely will never actually race Competitor Y and the impressively low acceleration figure requires launch control)".

For all the bench racing, chest-beating and minute dissection of quarter-mile times (sometimes even resulting not from actual quarter-mile times but from spreadsheet calculations and extrapolations), there is surprisingly little discussion about the real world every day use of these machines. I've done the race track thing, including instructing and wheel-to-wheel racing in a dedicated and properly equipped race car. With respect to a street car, I care much more about how it functions in every day use, whether it brings a smile to my face when I see it, when I start it, and when I drive it, how responsive is it on my daily drive to work, how comfortable it is after a day-long highway slog, etc. I cannot imagine making a $90,000 purchase decision based on whether the car I choose would beat some other car in a mythical 0-to-whatever race that will never happen. Maybe I am just an outlier here.
I bought my C63S to put my dog in the back and my bikes on the roof. I just happen to enjoy it too.

As someone who has driven lots of cars (and motorbikes) around tracks including single seaters with decent aero, I do agree that the vast majority of road cars are distinctly average when on track. It's still fun though.
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      11-14-2019, 12:25 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by MRichmond View Post
Is everyone here just for bragging rights?

First there is the inevitable stupid "SUVs don't belong on race tracks, but my four-door sedan with heated seats, 35-speaker sound system, 400 lbs of sound insulation, and acres of leather is a perfectly appropriate track car" claim. A tiny number of you ever will take your cars to a race track. And of that tiny number, a much tinier percentage will dedicate the time, effort and money to develop the driving skills necessary to drive any of these cars more aggressively than 7/10s without stuffing them into a tire wall (i.e., anywhere near the limit where the small marginal differences between these highly capable machines can become evident). Not to mention that anyone who is in any way serious about race track use will realize quickly that neither the X3M, nor the M3, nor any other street car is appropriate due to the severe compromises in safety.

Then there is the "My choice of the X3MC is vindicated because it is .1 seconds faster to 60 than a Competitor Y (never mind that I likely will never actually race Competitor Y and the impressively low acceleration figure requires launch control)".

For all the bench racing, chest-beating and minute dissection of quarter-mile times (sometimes even resulting not from actual quarter-mile times but from spreadsheet calculations and extrapolations), there is surprisingly little discussion about the real world every day use of these machines. I've done the race track thing, including instructing and wheel-to-wheel racing in a dedicated and properly equipped race car. With respect to a street car, I care much more about how it functions in every day use, whether it brings a smile to my face when I see it, when I start it, and when I drive it, how responsive is it on my daily drive to work, how comfortable it is after a day-long highway slog, etc. I cannot imagine making a $90,000 purchase decision based on whether the car I choose would beat some other car in a mythical 0-to-whatever race that will never happen. Maybe I am just an outlier here.
I bought my C63S to put my dog in the back.😉
I just happen to enjoy it too.
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      11-14-2019, 12:34 PM   #41
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.

Although I like beer, The Ring is a little too far from Texas for me to go just to have one.
The point is, that if you want a car for track days, you wouldn't choose an SUV. I bet you can get a lot of donuts in with seats down though! 🤣

Go on, live a little. German beer 🍺 is good and the 'Ring even better.
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      11-14-2019, 12:39 PM   #42
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Is everyone here just for bragging rights?

First there is the inevitable stupid "SUVs don't belong on race tracks, but my four-door sedan with heated seats, 35-speaker sound system, ....Maybe I am just an outlier here.
Stupid is, stupid does.

Heated seats are essential in the U.K. this time of year🤣
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      11-14-2019, 12:47 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
As someone who has driven lots of cars (and motorbikes) around tracks including single seaters with decent aero, I do agree that the vast majority of road cars are distinctly average when on track. It's still fun though.
No doubt. My track obsession started with my e60 M5, which I tracked and modified for a year and a half, before realizing that exceeding 160 mph each lap into a hard braking zone with no protection other than a three-point seat belt and a helmet wasn't a great idea. That car was especially fun at track days organized by Porsche clubs. The reactions progressed predictably through the day --

Morning -- You and your family sedan are going to get run over! Be ready to move aside.

Lunch -- Uhhmm, I suppose I can grudgingly accept you gaining on me on the long straight, but how exactly did you catch up to me in the turns?

Afternoon -- OK, you can come back.
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      11-14-2019, 12:48 PM   #44
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I bought my C63S to put my dog in the back and my bikes on the roof. I just happen to enjoy it too.

As someone who has driven lots of cars (and motorbikes) around tracks including single seaters with decent aero, I do agree that the vast majority of road cars are distinctly average when on track. It's still fun though.
I love that wagon. My buddy just got the E63S Wagon
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