[Rich4]

Originally Posted by Harplayr

......Having driven BMW’s since the 80’s (including 2 previous generation X3’s) I was still under the impression that BMW made driver’s cars and was not trying to compete with the likes of Lexus to see who could strip a car of any road feel or driver feedback and win the award for the most isolated feel in its class. The brand “BMW” used to mean something. That’s why I refer to this car as a “bmw”. ...........

Well put, my sentiments exactly. May I suggest you try higher tyre pressures by say 4 to 6 lbs more than recommended which is what I am currently trying out and it does gives a better feel to my standard 17” tyres – yet to try it on a longer/high speed run but so far though a bit harsher ride, for me anyway, it feels more direct. Have set mine at 37 front, 35 rear - it may be to the detriment of tyre life, but if it gives me the road feel I like, so be it.

[Harplayr]

Originally Posted by Rich4

Well put, my sentiments exactly. May I suggest you try higher tyre pressures by say 4 to 6 lbs more than recommended which is what I am currently trying out and it does gives a better feel to my standard 17” tyres – yet to try it on a longer/high speed run but so far though a bit harsher ride, for me anyway, it feels more direct. Have set mine at 37 front, 35 rear - it may be to the detriment of tyre life, but if it gives me the road feel I like, so be it.

Thanks, I'll give it a try.
Let me know what you think when you get a chance to give it a good run on the highway.

[DouginNC]

I have a 2011 and my steering does not feel vague or "not connected". The software update did add a bit more "on center feel" and more steering resistance. It is very light steering at low speeds. Makes my 128 feel like steering a dump truck when I first get behind the wheel.

My x3 has 18" Pirelli run flats. I run the tire pressures listed in the door jam. I didn't see what brand of tires you are running, but do know that tires make huge differences in how a vehicle drives. I'm not pushing Pirelli, they are just what came on it. Good luck.

My only complaint is the dang hesitation when accelerating after not coming to a complete stop. The throttle response on my other BMWs (past and present) is much better than my x3, even after the software update.

[Harplayr]

Originally Posted by DouginNC

I have a 2011 and my steering does not feel vague or "not connected". The software update did add a bit more "on center feel" and more steering resistance. It is very light steering at low speeds. Makes my 128 feel like steering a dump truck when I first get behind the wheel.

My x3 has 18" Pirelli run flats. I run the tire pressures listed in the door jam. I didn't see what brand of tires you are running, but do know that tires make huge differences in how a vehicle drives. I'm not pushing Pirelli, they are just what came on it. Good luck.

My only complaint is the dang hesitation when accelerating after not coming to a complete stop. The throttle response on my other BMWs (past and present) is much better than my x3, even after the software update.

I have the Bridgestone run flats.
My car is a different setup from yours. I have 17" and you have 18". Do you have any of the sports or handling packages?

What software update did you have that impacted the steering?
I had SI B24 02 12 done. It helped with the acceleration / hesitation issue but had no impact what so ever on steering, road feel or handling. More "on center" and a little more resistance like your car has would improve my car greatly.

[Nahoa]

Originally Posted by Harplayr

A simple honest answer without the snide overtones would have been much better.

Yes, I do take responsibility for not test driving a X3 without the expensive add-on options designed to correct their design mistakes. I was an early adopter with an amazing trade in offer on my 2010 X3 on the table and the only models available for test were fully loaded in that department. I ordered a couple of weeks after the national rollout "X3 experience" event where I drove their loaded X3.

Having driven BMW’s since the 80’s (including 2 previous generation X3’s) I was still under the impression that BMW made driver’s cars and was not trying to compete with the likes of Lexus to see who could strip a car of any road feel or driver feedback and win the award for the most isolated feel in its class. The brand “BMW” used to mean something. That’s why I refer to this car as a “bmw”.

As I’ve said, I enjoy the <strike>Lexus</strike> “bmw” X3 in every other respect, and the other features compensate enough to give me good overall satisfaction with the car. If it were possible to mod this car via adjustment, programming, replacing tires, upping the wheels from 17 to 18’s then it would be worth it to me. But I guess the answer’s no, so I’ll live with my mistake and drive this as-is until it’s time to trade it in. This will most likely be my last BMW and I certainly won’t buy another “bmw” as I’ll be in search of something that DOES provide good driver feedback.

It was an honest, simple, direct answer. Didn't use enough words to be snide. That was your read, not my intent. Your view of the steering us yours and I don't disagree -- it doesn't matter as much to me and I don't think the feel is as bad as it seems to you, but I know where you're coming from. In the end, the answer to your question is that the steering feel is adjustable if you chose to equip the car with that option, and not adjustable if you ddn't.

[HighlandPete]

Have any of you guys actually changed wheels and/or tires?

I know the wheel sets make a massive difference on other model ranges to the vague feeling and road feel.

But this issue has existed, even on the hydraulic steering systems, when run-flat tyres are fitted to the models.

I do feel we need to spec' very carefully these days as the standard offerings are not necessarily well tuned for long term BMW driver. But we know BMW are into bigger markets, and not just a few enthusiasts who want more road feel and more weighting to the steering, as the standard offering. They supply a list of options for the enthusiast, (steering and suspensions).

Reading just a couple of days ago, how a new X1 driver seriously wants to lighten the steering, as it is far heavier than cars he is used to driving. Possibly reflects the opinion of the new breed of BMW customer.

But back to the topic issue, still don't under estimate the way the tires will mess with steering precision. Certainly experiment with pressures, many run RFT pressures far too low (hoping to improve the ride quality), but dull the steering in doing so. Tweaking the toe setting can often improve a vague setup as well.

HighlandPete

[Harplayr]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

Have any of you guys actually changed wheels and/or tires?

I know the wheel sets make a massive difference on other model ranges to the vague feeling and road feel.

But this issue has existed, even on the hydraulic steering systems, when run-flat tyres are fitted to the models.

I do feel we need to spec' very carefully these days as the standard offerings are not necessarily well tuned for long term BMW driver. But we know BMW are into bigger markets, and not just a few enthusiasts who want more road feel and more weighting to the steering, as the standard offering. They supply a list of options for the enthusiast, (steering and suspensions).

Reading just a couple of days ago, how a new X1 driver seriously wants to lighten the steering, as it is far heavier than cars he is used to driving. Possibly reflects the opinion of the new breed of BMW customer.

But back to the topic issue, still don't under estimate the way the tires will mess with steering precision. Certainly experiment with pressures, many run RFT pressures far too low (hoping to improve the ride quality), but dull the steering in doing so. Tweaking the toe setting can often improve a vague setup as well.

HighlandPete

Thanks for the suggestions.

I suspect that going to 18” from 17” and swapping out the tires to something better may improve things.
That is a very expensive experiment though and what I was hoping for was to see if others in my situation had already tried that with success.

I will certainly try upping the tire pressure to see if that helps, that is a simple and cheep thing to try. I live in a somewhat rural area of Illinois and there are no real alignment specialty shops here. The dealer will only align to BMW specs, so unless I can come with specs in hand it may be difficult to convince them to align the car to non-standard specs. Can you suggest the alignment specs to try?

[gareth3685]

Originally Posted by Harplayr

Thanks for the suggestions.

I suspect that going to 18” from 17” and swapping out the tires to something better may improve things.
That is a very expensive experiment though and what I was hoping for was to see if others in my situation had already tried that with success.

I will certainly try upping the tire pressure to see if that helps, that is a simple and cheep thing to try. I live in a somewhat rural area of Illinois and there are no real alignment specialty shops here. The dealer will only align to BMW specs, so unless I can come with specs in hand it may be difficult to convince them to align the car to non-standard specs. Can you suggest the alignment specs to try?

Does your dealer not have a demonstrator with 18" wheels that you can try to compare?

I can assure you however that there is a noticable difference between X3's running the different rim sizes.

[Harplayr]

Originally Posted by gareth3685

Does your dealer not have a demonstrator with 18" wheels that you can try to compare?

I can assure you however that there is a noticable difference between X3's running the different rim sizes.

They don't have any stripped down models with 18's so testing a model with the options wouldn't be a good test.

I talked to the service advisor today and he'll speak with the mechanic to see if he knows any adjustments. The service manager didn't seem too adverse to making a slight alignment change. He just warned me that it may cause premature tire wear. I'll wait to see what the mechanic says.

I also talked to the sales man and told him I'd be interested in buying a set of 18's if any of their customers want to swap or upgrade their wheels.

[DouginNC]

Originally Posted by Harplayr

I have the Bridgestone run flats.
My car is a different setup from yours. I have 17" and you have 18". Do you have any of the sports or handling packages?

What software update did you have that impacted the steering?
I had SI B24 02 12 done. It helped with the acceleration / hesitation issue but had no impact what so ever on steering, road feel or handling. More "on center" and a little more resistance like your car has would improve my car greatly.

I do have a sports package but not the M Sport package so I can't select sport mode vs normal except at the transmission; which we all can l do. think the package I have provided the 18" wheels, sport steering wheel and sport seats. The software package you listed is the one that helped the steering feel.

[torzeck]

Originally Posted by DouginNC

I do have a sports package but not the M Sport package so I can't select sport mode vs normal except at the transmission; which we all can l do. think the package I have provided the 18" wheels, sport steering wheel and sport seats. The software package you listed is the one that helped the steering feel.

If you have the sport mode rocker switch on the center console then, not only do the shift points and throttle response change, but also the steering gets a little heavier in sport mode.
You will get a screen on your idrive wen you select sport mode that will allow you to slect either the drivetrain to be modified or drivetrain and chassis.
The drivetrain and chassis selection will modify the throttle, the shift points and the steering. If you have DHP the shocks will stiffen up as well,

[Harplayr]

Originally Posted by torzeck

If you have the sport mode rocker switch on the center console then, not only do the shift points and throttle response change, but also the steering gets a little heavier in sport mode.
You will get a screen on your idrive wen you select sport mode that will allow you to slect either the drivetrain to be modified or drivetrain and chassis.
The drivetrain and chassis selection will modify the throttle, the shift points and the steering. If you have DHP the shocks will stiffen up as well,

The funny thing is that after I had the SIB applied that option appeared on my Idrive. However even though I can check either drive train, chasis, both or none it has no impact.

I don't have the rocker switch, and sliding the gear lever to manual (sport) only impacts the shift points and throtle responce but not steering regardless of what is checked.

[bigcat_lu]

Originally Posted by Harplayr

The funny thing is that after I had the SIB applied that option appeared on my Idrive. However even though I can check either drive train, chasis, both or none it has no impact.

I don't have the rocker switch, and sliding the gear lever to manual (sport) only impacts the shift points and throtle responce but not steering regardless of what is checked.

DSC OFF mode (press DSC for 10 seconds) is shown in Idrive as "sport oriented chassis settings". It does make the steering heavier. Not safe to drive this mode in rain/highway but worth a try if you complain about the vague steering. I think it's similar to "sport+".

[Harplayr]

Originally Posted by bigcat_lu

DSC OFF mode (press DSC for 10 seconds) is shown in Idrive as "sport oriented chassis settings". It does make the steering heavier. Not safe to drive this mode in rain/highway but worth a try if you complain about the vague steering. I think it's similar to "sport+".

That's interesting, I never knew that DSC OFF impacted steering assist.
That won't do me much good though because I don't want to compromise safety and the numb steering bothers me most at highway speeds.

[midlifecrisis]

I haven't been happy with the steering feel of my X3, although I otherwise love the vehicle. Last night I took a spin in a friend's X5 35i and immediately wondered whether I bought the wrong car. The steering in the X5 is much better, IMO. The steering effort is higher, but so is the feedback in the wheel. The ratio is slower in the X5, but it feels like a BMW where the X3 does not.

I recently drove a F30 328i, and had the same impression as with the X3. Nice car, too bad about the steering. This is such a basic part of BMW's DNA that they must fix it. If I want a Lexus I'll shop elsewhere. I'm depressed to think that I might have to shop elsewhere to find something that feels like a BMW.

[clivem2]

Originally Posted by Harplayr

I suspect that going to 18” from 17” and swapping out the tires to something better may improve things.

What tyres do you get with 17" rims in the US? When I got my UK X3 the 17's were non-RFT (I have 18's). If you've got "real" tyres you may have better ride but with less solid sidewalls which would change road feel.

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by clivem2

What tyres do you get with 17" rims in the US? When I got my UK X3 the 17's were non-RFT (I have 18's). If you've got "real" tyres you may have better ride but with less solid sidewalls which would change road feel.

Absolutely, I've come to the conclusion that because BMW offer so many wheel/tire sizes, suspension/option combinations these days, there are compromises to the basic drive performance, which make even the 'same' models "chalk and cheese" to drive.

Therefore wheel/tire choice is more critical, as working parameters across the wheels are very wide. We must test drive and choose a package that suits our driving needs.

Even BMW tech' documents infer there are compromises, due to wheel selection. If we think about it, there has to be, if we have wheel options on the same basic setup.

I've just changed from an E91 3-series to an F11 5-series. Specification has been very critical, to get the BMW feel I love to drive. I've got it, but many examples would have missed the mark by a big margin, due to specification and option choice.

HighlandPete

[BMWs]

We need to find the coding to manually set the steering to Sport. I often turn DSC off to get the steering firmed up but rather it stay in Sport always. Anyone know what module this is located?

[kwachtler]

I just purchased a 7 year old, 2012 X3 'base model' with 90K miles, as my 1st foray into high-performance luxury vehicle (previous honda). As Harplayr stated back in 2011, my X3 will not hold a straight line at highway speed. No issues around town/short trips, but appears when freeway cruising (70 mph) for an uninterrupted period. At first it seems related to road surface, then disappears, then returns. After 10-15 minutes at speed, it becomes clear that its the car, not the road. The result is a slow-motion weaving back-and forth over the center line, as a correction is made in one direction, over-corrects no matter how lightly the correction was made, then have to correct back in the other direction. Alignment and new tires had no effect. It does not feel like physical alignment/ball joint issues that I have known on other cars, instead feels like something is taking control (similar to "lane assist" on 2019 cars, but with the opposite effect). As Harplayr stated, the rest of the car is perfect.
So as I cruise down the freeway, noting less expensive/older cars holding center-line effortlessly... questioning the value of new intervention features, especially as car ages since expensive diagnostic/repair could equal 1/4 the value of the car, if fixable at all.
Willing to listen to any advice or suggestions. Thank you !