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      01-23-2021, 11:53 AM   #67
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My tune: Mission Performance E50 OTS

Stock MB E53 didn't know what hit him. 0-80MPH. Put buses on him.

"Dude that is sick, like wtf!" 🤣


-----
Stock E63S couldn't keep up on the highway after WOT trying to pass me 🤣

5 minutes later we pull into our neighborhood and there he is. He's a neighbor. So made a friend out of it. 😁
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      01-24-2021, 09:02 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by 2020X3M View Post
This is surprising. How much more power is the mp tune making on 93? This looks like it put lengths on the bm3? I am pretty set on the bm3 tune so I’m just trying to understand how mp tuned car is so much faster in this video?
Based on the dyno data, about 50 more whp on 93 octane goes to the MP tune. It helps when the tuner (MP) literally owns an X3M and can tune it to perfection right off the bat.

You could go with BM3 and get a custom tune for 93 and be just as fast after multiple revisions, but then you would be out $1100-1200 and still have an slower E tune (E30 OTS) vs. $900 or so from MP.... the beauty is you get the fast 93 out of the box along with the E50 tune that also runs faster then E30 BM3, vids in this thread show it

Either way good luck and enjoy the car.
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      01-24-2021, 09:04 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by sd306 View Post
Stock MB E53 didn't know what hit him. 0-80MPH. Put buses on him.

"Dude that is sick, like wtf!" 🤣


-----
Stock E63S couldn't keep up on the highway after WOT trying to pass me 🤣

5 minutes later we pull into our neighborhood and there he is. He's a neighbor. So made a friend out of it. 😁



Would be interesting to see E63S vs. 93 tune.
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      01-24-2021, 09:54 AM   #70
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I know a few are running JB4 out there. Can anyone chime in here? I've always piggybacked my Bimmers and been very happy, so no interest in a flash. Just curious how they do out in the real world. I know won't compare to flash tune, but would love to see some kills. Planning an F97 order in the next few weeks and planning mods now
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      01-24-2021, 10:05 AM   #71
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Originally Posted by spuntyb View Post
I know a few are running JB4 out there. Can anyone chime in here? I've always piggybacked my Bimmers and been very happy, so no interest in a flash. Just curious how they do out in the real world. I know won't compare to flash tune, but would love to see some kills. Planning an F97 order in the next few weeks and planning mods now
BMW now detects piggybacks as easily as they do flash tunes. Flash tunes run smoother and extract more performance gains. In my humble view, there is little reason left to choose JB4 over popular flash tune platforms such as BM3.
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      01-24-2021, 10:08 AM   #72
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Originally Posted by spuntyb View Post
I know a few are running JB4 out there. Can anyone chime in here? I've always piggybacked my Bimmers and been very happy, so no interest in a flash. Just curious how they do out in the real world. I know won't compare to flash tune, but would love to see some kills. Planning an F97 order in the next few weeks and planning mods now
Here two links to JB4-related threads. Our main JB4 S58 thread has sadly become inactive.
https://x3.xbimmers.com/forums/showt...ght=JB4&page=4
https://x3.xbimmers.com/forums/showt...&highlight=JB4
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      01-24-2021, 10:15 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexFL View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by spuntyb View Post
I know a few are running JB4 out there. Can anyone chime in here? I've always piggybacked my Bimmers and been very happy, so no interest in a flash. Just curious how they do out in the real world. I know won't compare to flash tune, but would love to see some kills. Planning an F97 order in the next few weeks and planning mods now
Here two links to JB4-related threads. Our main JB4 S58 thread has sadly become inactive.
https://x3.xbimmers.com/forums/showt...JB4&page=4
https://x3.xbimmers.com/forums/showt...;highlight=JB4
Thanks!

Seems the good ole' trusted piggyback is falling by the wayside. Will definitely have to consider a flash tune after break-in
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      01-24-2021, 09:41 PM   #74
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Originally Posted by 2020X3M View Post
Wow 50 more whp is huge! Thanks.
Don’t get fooled by some one-off, shady youtube races that supposedly prove which tune is faster. The truth is that those race outcomes are highly dependent on the individual experience levels of the two drivers and you will never truly know which tunes/ethanol% were used in that race. Back to the dyno numbers. It is true that the BM3 OTS maps are more on the conservative side. Conservative also means safe. You can (and probably should) get a BM3-based custom tune that will be just as strong as what MP offers but will be meticulously adjusted by the bimmer greats F80 Paul, Cary the Label guy, and few others to your individual car characteristics for the cleanest logs possible. For example, my E50-fueled, F80 Paul-tuned (12 updates!) car pulled 638 whp on the dynojet and this number is virtually identical to the MP’s advertised E50 whp number. My 60-130 mph numbers are as good as Mp’s or better. Even better, you can customize your burble settings with the BM3 software, run very detailed data logs, share your logs with the BM3 S58 community that has more than two members, and have access to many more features currently not offered by MP or any other S58 tuner platform. BM3 has been the most popular flash tune platform for BMW for years - likely for a good reason.
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      01-25-2021, 10:38 AM   #75
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Originally Posted by AlexFL View Post
Don’t get fooled by some one-off, shady youtube races that supposedly prove which tune is faster. The truth is that those race outcomes are highly dependent on the individual experience levels of the two drivers and you will never truly know which tunes/ethanol% were used in that race. Back to the dyno numbers. It is true that the BM3 OTS maps are more on the conservative side. Conservative also means safe. You can (and probably should) get a BM3-based custom tune that will be just as strong as what MP offers but will be meticulously adjusted by the bimmer greats F80 Paul, Cary the Label guy, and few others to your individual car characteristics for the cleanest logs possible. For example, my E50-fueled, F80 Paul-tuned (12 updates!) car pulled 638 whp on the dynojet and this number is virtually identical to the MP’s advertised E50 whp number. My 60-130 mph numbers are as good as Mp’s or better. Even better, you can customize your burble settings with the BM3 software, run very detailed data logs, share your logs with the BM3 S58 community that has more than two members, and have access to many more features currently not offered by MP or any other S58 tuner platform. BM3 has been the most popular flash tune platform for BMW for years - likely for a good reason.
Agree with this 100%. My BM3 e30 OTS ran 8.1 60-130 with a full tank and I know Alex has to be the mid 7s with his custom e50.

Last edited by hellcat2m4; 01-25-2021 at 11:02 AM..
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      01-25-2021, 01:50 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by sd306 View Post
I'll start, post any info about your kills or loses and list your mods. All testing was done on a private road or track.

Car: 2020 X4M Non-Comp
Mods: BM3 Stage 1 E30 tune (running on e40 fuel)

Audi S4 540WHP from a dig. He used 2 step/launch control and i did a rolling start to reduce wear. He pulled away for a bit then ripped by him still

Porsche 911 S
Pretty good, but X4M still pulled ahead, rolling.

Newer Mustang v6 turbo apparently - not sure about specs or accuracy of the v6 turbo, but damn looked like he was standing still.

I love the fact that the X3M X4M is a bit stealthy. Some comments were "wtf, an SUV shouldn't be that fast"
I got x4mc and on drag strip with 1/2 tank of e30 bootmod and catless dp with spare tire and im 235. 11.0@125. The car can do better, i was slipping till 3rd. S58 is a monster. Thinking of adding methanol
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      01-25-2021, 02:57 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by Daniely30 View Post
I got x4mc and on drag strip with 1/2 tank of e30 bootmod and catless dp with spare tire and im 235. 11.0@125. The car can do better, i was slipping till 3rd. S58 is a monster. Thinking of adding methanol
Yea you should be around 127-128 trap speed with those mods for sure.
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      01-25-2021, 11:01 PM   #78
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I had BM3 e30 and now MP e50. Both OTS. BM3 features are 100x better, but I wanted a bit more power from an OTS flash. I'm using MHD to log and they looks great! Thankfully MHD has the monitoring license so I can still use my phone to log. MHD is much faster to log, check codes, etc, but sharing has an extra step compared to BM3. MHD i'm using now is also wired versus the BM3 wifi agent so probably why it's faster.

Either tune haven't lost to anyone 😁😁 and they are both great thus far. I mentioned before if BM3 comes out with full ethanol adjustment or anti-lag i'll switch back to BM3.

MP has a tuning strategy like BMW does for M cars per their post vs tuning like a non-M BMW. You'll have to read more bc that's all I know. From the logs the throttle is much more variable compared to other tunes I've had and seems to spool faster - this tune does have more power intentionally so could just be that higher boost. Either way I'm never running anything lower than the BM3 E30 map 🤣

I'd like to compare the BM3 e30 logs vs MP e50 logs more but as soon as i sold BM3 all my shared logs were nuked and all the links broke
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      01-25-2021, 11:08 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spuntyb View Post
I know a few are running JB4 out there. Can anyone chime in here? I've always piggybacked my Bimmers and been very happy, so no interest in a flash. Just curious how they do out in the real world. I know won't compare to flash tune, but would love to see some kills. Planning an F97 order in the next few weeks and planning mods now
Like AlexFL said they can detect both. Technically the JB4 would be harder to prove as it doesn't change the flash counter like a flash would. I believe BM3 and MP can lock the flash counter with a bench flash and MP has an additional special way or storing your eeprom when it's stock. However, with the JB4 it will increase boost and those logs are stored somewhere saying "max psi observed was blah" higher than stock (from what I understand) So BMW goes "uh okay buddy" 🤣

Their system (ISTA) also auto-reports it now. So the BMW tech don'y even do anything. They just plug it in and it's flagged and sent to BMW. From what I understand. MP said it was due to some acceleration calculation they do IIRC.
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      01-25-2021, 11:43 PM   #80
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Break in service today....on my drive back I ran into a 997 4S, played around a bit and I clearly had him. Rolled his window down and said “MAN that thing is FAST!”

Our “X3s” seem to catch everyone off guard (including myself post break in!)
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      01-26-2021, 04:49 AM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sd306 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by spuntyb View Post
I know a few are running JB4 out there. Can anyone chime in here? I've always piggybacked my Bimmers and been very happy, so no interest in a flash. Just curious how they do out in the real world. I know won't compare to flash tune, but would love to see some kills. Planning an F97 order in the next few weeks and planning mods now
Like AlexFL said they can detect both. Technically the JB4 would be harder to prove as it doesn't change the flash counter like a flash would. I believe BM3 and MP can lock the flash counter with a bench flash and MP has an additional special way or storing your eeprom when it's stock. However, with the JB4 it will increase boost and those logs are stored somewhere saying "max psi observed was blah" higher than stock (from what I understand) So BMW goes "uh okay buddy" 🤣

Their system (ISTA) also auto-reports it now. So the BMW tech don'y even do anything. They just plug it in and it's flagged and sent to BMW. From what I understand. MP said it was due to some acceleration calculation they do IIRC.
Well aware: New engine/Gintani hub after spun crank hub https://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1752927

I just have always done piggybacks because they're dead simple, and it's an excuse to get me working under the hood, which I rarely get to do any more. I will likely just give up the ghost though and go for a flash tune once the time comes

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      01-26-2021, 11:39 AM   #82
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It's still recommended to flash back to stock and drive 300-400 miles at variable speeds before going to the dealer to clear out the logs.
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      01-26-2021, 01:08 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexFL View Post
Don’t get fooled by some one-off, shady youtube races that supposedly prove which tune is faster. The truth is that those race outcomes are highly dependent on the individual experience levels of the two drivers and you will never truly know which tunes/ethanol% were used in that race. Back to the dyno numbers. It is true that the BM3 OTS maps are more on the conservative side. Conservative also means safe. You can (and probably should) get a BM3-based custom tune that will be just as strong as what MP offers but will be meticulously adjusted by the bimmer greats F80 Paul, Cary the Label guy, and few others to your individual car characteristics for the cleanest logs possible. For example, my E50-fueled, F80 Paul-tuned (12 updates!) car pulled 638 whp on the dynojet and this number is virtually identical to the MP’s advertised E50 whp number. My 60-130 mph numbers are as good as Mp’s or better. Even better, you can customize your burble settings with the BM3 software, run very detailed data logs, share your logs with the BM3 S58 community that has more than two members, and have access to many more features currently not offered by MP or any other S58 tuner platform. BM3 has been the most popular flash tune platform for BMW for years - likely for a good reason.
Just purchased an X3M and looking for power, so I am between Mission Performance and BM3.

I race a lot and plan on going to the track VERY often. I see a lot of people have switched from BM3 to MP because the out of the box maps are faster with MP. What is the cost for a custom tune on average and is it easy to log?

The videos seem to show power is quite a bit more with MP even at the track (5 MPH is a lot), what is your 60-130 time?
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      01-26-2021, 02:48 PM   #84
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BM3 stage 2 e30 OTS I got 8.1 60-130 in 100ish DA going uphill on an 0.88% incline.

If you take the incline out it would be 7.9sec.
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      01-26-2021, 02:53 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X3MMM View Post
Just purchased an X3M and looking for power, so I am between Mission Performance and BM3.

I race a lot and plan on going to the track VERY often. I see a lot of people have switched from BM3 to MP because the out of the box maps are faster with MP. What is the cost for a custom tune on average and is it easy to log?

The videos seem to show power is quite a bit more with MP even at the track (5 MPH is a lot), what is your 60-130 time?
Go BM3 E50 custom tune if you are actually racing from BM3tuning and/or Paul Johnson. It's the most power, fastest times, and mobile logging is really good. Should cost about $1200 total for BM3 license and custom tune. Should cost about $20 for ENET cable and $40 for iOS to ethernet that includes additional lightning port for pass thru charging. You will need to go back and forth with the tuner to get a refined map say 5-15 times - depends on how perfect you want it.

https://www.amazon.com/Ethernet-Inte.../dp/B00MECEI14

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07DPLLLNT

Also get the Fuel-it ethanol analyzer so you can ensure you are actually running E50.
https://www.fuel-it.com/bmw-x4m-and-...lex-fuel-kits/

If you just want to go fast the MP E50 or E85 is the fastest OTS. Both tuners recommend E50 as the fuel pumps don't do as well with higher E.
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      01-27-2021, 02:10 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sd306 View Post
Go BM3 E50 custom tune if you are actually racing from BM3tuning and/or Paul Johnson. It's the most power, fastest times, and mobile logging is really good. Should cost about $1200 total for BM3 license and custom tune. Should cost about $20 for ENET cable and $40 for iOS to ethernet that includes additional lightning port for pass thru charging. You will need to go back and forth with the tuner to get a refined map say 5-15 times - depends on how perfect you want it.

https://www.amazon.com/Ethernet-Inte.../dp/B00MECEI14

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07DPLLLNT

Also get the Fuel-it ethanol analyzer so you can ensure you are actually running E50.
https://www.fuel-it.com/bmw-x4m-and-...lex-fuel-kits/

If you just want to go fast the MP E50 or E85 is the fastest OTS. Both tuners recommend E50 as the fuel pumps don't do as well with higher E.
Thanks for the info, does MP need to refine the tune? Or offer that? $1200 total for license and custom E tune isn't bad, but that also includes a fast/custom 93 tune too right? I want both 93 and E50 to be fast out of the gate.

What's the fastest tune only 60-130 MP tune only and fastest 60-130 BM3 tune only (no exhaust, intake, wheels, etc.)?
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      01-27-2021, 02:20 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X3MMM View Post
Thanks for the info, does MP need to refine the tune? Or offer that? $1200 total for license and custom E tune isn't bad, but that also includes a fast/custom 93 tune too right? I want both 93 and E50 to be fast out of the gate.

What's the fastest tune only 60-130 MP tune only and fastest 60-130 BM3 tune only (no exhaust, intake, wheels, etc.)?
No, MP is ready to go out of the box for E30, E50, or E85 (they have multiple OTS ethanol maps) and can take a small variation in ethanol. They may offer refinement - not sure. E50 is best performance to strain ratio for the HPFP for either tune.

For the BM3 license you get 1 tune of your choice from the OTS maps available - $600. Then can buy a map pack that includes 91,93, AND E30, etc OTS maps for $100 (highly recommended). Then you buy a separate E50 custom tune for $600. Then you buy another separate custom tune for 93 - which would be $600, but I would expect you could probably get a discount for 2 custom maps. The OTS E30 BM3 is stupid fast.

60-130 for MP E50 OTS and BM3 E30 OTS have been around 7.7 - 8.2 thus far from what I have seen. MP was the faster of the two - more ethanol.

MP is faster for the OTS map 0-60 from my experience. best BM3 E30 i could get was 3.22, best MP E50 was 2.94.
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      01-27-2021, 08:45 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X3MMM View Post
Thanks for the info, does MP need to refine the tune? Or offer that? $1200 total for license and custom E tune isn't bad, but that also includes a fast/custom 93 tune too right? I want both 93 and E50 to be fast out of the gate.

What's the fastest tune only 60-130 MP tune only and fastest 60-130 BM3 tune only (no exhaust, intake, wheels, etc.)?
I'm in NJ too and so is 2020X3M , you guys are related?

BM3 is the fastest Tune only 10.51 1/4 mile unprepped surface Dragy friend in Qatar and 10.61 in my car.

Not everyone has the opportunity to hit the track so Dragy 1/4 mile with a good slope does it. There are track who have -1% slope so of course some cars will go faster at those. But at the end of the day, 1/4 mile is a combination of things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sd306 View Post
60-130 for MP E50 OTS and BM3 E30 OTS have been around 7.7 - 8.2 thus far from what I have seen. MP was the faster of the two - more ethanol.

MP is faster for the OTS map 0-60 from my experience. best BM3 E30 i could get was 3.22, best MP E50 was 2.94.
3/4 tank BM3 E30 STG1 w/ @MVPMotoring Race Pipes (Primary Only)


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