[chewietobbacca]

Hi all,

I've been helping my folks research a new SUV and the redesigned X3 caught my eye. I noticed that 2011 reviews tended to talk about the throttle un-evenness as being an issue, but I didn't really think about it until I took my parents to test drive it.

We test drove a 2011 X3 28i (dealer didn't have any 2012's on the lot) and to my surprise, my mother of all people felt the car was sluggish/heavy feeling (i know, i know, it's only a 28i) but I didn't feel the same way. Of course, my driving style tends to push the throttle more which after looking up the issue, seems to occur when people push the throttle too lightly and thus the car lurches once it suddenly reaches a certain input point.

So I had a few questions:

1. Did the 2012's fix this? Or is this one of those design things (to save fuel, I'd imagine)?

2. Is there a difference in this between the 28i's and 35i's? Obviously, the 35i's are going to be much quicker and pull harder, but is throttle lurch still there?

3. I've read that getting the dynamic handling package and leaving the car in sport/sport+ mode helps with this issue. Is this true?

Finally, has anyone with 2011's noticed whether the car adapts to driving habits and/or gotten used to this? Coming from an M3, I'm used to the car getting up and going smoothly, not this unevenness.

The car itself was perfect, it's just annoying to see so much of the car so well done only to have a pretty important thing feel wrong.

[gmazet]

yes, the issue is on our 28i.. it's a bit annoying, I'm trying to find that sweet spot for leaving the light not too soft, not too snappy.. i see my wife's head snapping back to the headrest half the time, I feel like we are wallowing out the other half. wish a tune/flash could even out the throttle mapping a bit more linear..

[paul386]

I would agree with most here. After a few thousand miles the "issue" is non existent because you get used to the car.

[colson79]

I say you need to drive a 35i and see if you still notice it. A lot of people have reported the issue but I have never noticed it. It might just be how I drive but my wife has never mentioned it to me either.

[tuco44]

It's a non-issue, IMO. Once you driven it a few days, you don't even notice it. Plus, I think many overstate the issue to begin with. And it's NOT a design flaw, it's meant to be that way.

[rgx3]

You'd bitch if I hung you with a new rope! My wife and I have only 437 miles on our 35i and have experienced abrupt throttle at small throttle openings especially when starting out. After only a few miles each time we drive it, I don't even notice it. My wife even commented on the difference. So, if you haven't gotten used to the throttle yet. You will.

[sard]

I have a 2011 so it doesn't pertain to your exact question, but .. I have adapted my foot to the throttle, but it doesn't mean it's not there. Specially when you're slowing down to a stop, just about to stop, but then have to accelerate. You have to take that extra bit of time and care to avoid that whip lash. I hardly think this is insignificant. After all, we all might as well have bought less expensive automobiles if details did not matter to us.

My 2008 M3 DCT has to have the pedal pushed further down before it starts moving also, but it definitely does not have such a narrow window of giving you whip lash if you push it just a tiny bit too much.

The touchy throttle and "rocking horse" loss of forward motion between gear shifts are two of my few gripes on the X3. Oh I only have 1500 miles on the car so far.

[TreeSkier]

With all due respect, I have had my 35i for several months now (4500 mi) and find the throttle response in normal mode quite irritating. I've adapted and most of the time I smoothly accelerate from a stop but when I find myself needing to take off quicker for some reason (like I'm not paying attention at a stop light), I almost always apply too much throttle and find the car taking off rather harshly with too much power. I have found that using the Auto-H setting helps tremendously though. I almost never have to worry about a smooth take off when using Auto-H unless the car doesn't actually come to a complete stop and I have to accelerate, in that case, I need to accelerate very smoothly and slowly. I've come to really like the Auto-H function.

I also have jumped to the conclusion that BMW will never change the normal throttle response programing as that is how they get the highest EPA gas mileage rating possible. As owners, we can chose to change the response by using Sport mode, or in my case, Auto-H.

[Nahoa]

Or learnimg to control you foot. It's very doable with a little focus. If you almost always apply to much throttle in that situation then don't. Back off, slow down. Smooth is fast.

I think the pedal allows for fantastic rapid take-off as well as fine control for a slow, variable departure. I'd be disappointed if they changed it. If I wanted a car that drove like a Lexus, I'd buy a Lexus.

[Bimar]

So this problem is not in the diesels?

[JSY]

I have a 2009 X3 and experience this but I've gotten used to it and have adapted my driving to it (having also experienced it on my 2007 X3 before). I am picking up my 2012 X3 in a week or two and I suspect to adapt to that too. I've gotten so used to it like Nahoa has mentioned and know what to expect - so it's not really noticeable anymore. It would probably be jarring if it didn't react that way anymore.

[JOHNBMWM5]

Never experienced it at all in mine, but it is the 35D M S Rocket

[n55x3]

While I can't directly comment on the 2012s my wife has put about 14,000 miles on her '11 n55 x3 and the lurch has gone no where. When people ask about the car we usually say it is without a doubt the worst vehicle you could ever imagine from 0-2 mph, above 2 mph it is without a doubt the best suv we have owned.

I would say about 75% of the time it feels like we are doing a neutral drop to get going from a start regardless of pedal modulation. It is unbelievably annoying. We have an ML350 and the difference is amazing, the Benz is so smooth from a stop. Motortrend does a pretty good job of explaining this issue in one of their reviews too so it is definitely not isolated to the n55 motor. Seems to be a ZF related issue if anything. I see a lot of comments about pedal modulation and the likes to resolve this but I assure you in our specific X3 no matter how the throttle is applied it is never linear. Also this is absolutely not turbo lag, my daily driver is a Legacy GT, thus I am very familiar with turbo lag. Besides, the turbo setup in the N55 all but eliminates turbo lag. It is a very smooth motor.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...e28i_update_3/

Other than that, 14,000 miles and not a single warning or error light. Keeping our fingers crossed!

[nonagon]

Originally Posted by n55x3

While I can't directly comment on the 2012s my wife has put about 14,000 miles on her '11 n55 x3 and the lurch has gone no where. When people ask about the car we usually say it is without a doubt the worst vehicle you could ever imagine from 0-2 mph, above 2 mph it is without a doubt the best suv we have owned.

I would say about 75% of the time it feels like we are doing a neutral drop to get going from a start regardless of pedal modulation. It is unbelievably annoying. We have an ML350 and the difference is amazing, the Benz is so smooth from a stop. Motortrend does a pretty good job of explaining this issue in one of their reviews too so it is definitely not isolated to the n55 motor. Seems to be a ZF related issue if anything. I see a lot of comments about pedal modulation and the likes to resolve this but I assure you in our specific X3 no matter how the throttle is applied it is never linear. Also this is absolutely not turbo lag, my daily driver is a Legacy GT, thus I am very familiar with turbo lag. Besides, the turbo setup in the N55 all but eliminates turbo lag. It is a very smooth motor.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...e28i_update_3/

Other than that, 14,000 miles and not a single warning or error light. Keeping our fingers crossed!

Have you tried using the auto hold feature? That might help according to jdavid, above. I've no issues with the throttle response on mine.

[n55x3]

Actually, yes when in auto hold there is never a lag interestingly enough. Glad you and jdavid mentioned that. If I am driving and in a position to where I know I need to take off quickly I put it in sport and into auto hold and everything is dandy. I've offered this suggestion to my wife and she is still slow to adopt this method.

[Matchurin]

AutoHold definitely helps, but that "oh shit!" moment when pulling out in traffic or turning left at an intersection and the car feels like the engine suddenly disappeared is a bit unnerving.

[sparoz]

I don't have any problem taking off, as I always use more throttle when taking off than cruising. My only issue is when I am slowing down in a corner and try to take off after. The gearing is around 1500rpm and it is just not enough for it to take off.

However, the problem is not in ability, but in the intention of the designer for it to save fuel. As someone's mentioned earlier - there's always the sport mode which is just a flick of the wrist that puts the car above 2k rpm all the time which solves the problem.

[Beyu]

Originally Posted by sparoz

I don't have any problem taking off, as I always use more throttle when taking off than cruising. My only issue is when I am slowing down in a corner and try to take off after. The gearing is around 1500rpm and it is just not enough for it to take off.

However, the problem is not in ability, but in the intention of the designer for it to save fuel. As someone's mentioned earlier - there's always the sport mode which is just a flick of the wrist that puts the car above 2k rpm all the time which solves the problem.

Exactly Sparoz, while the throttle tip in or lurching is annoying at times it really isn't that big of a deal and shouldn't detract from what is otherwise a great car. Both issues aren't even a concern in sport mode and mostly arises when using normal mode.

Throttle Issue/Lurching

From a Stop: Push harder on accelerator when initially starting from a stop then let off a bit once you've gained some momentum.

When Cornering: Either slowly go around a corner, use sport mode, or shift the gears yourself.

[n55x3]

On our X3 the 'neutral drop' feeling is there regardless of being in sport or normal mode. Not sure how being in sport mode is really even applicable here. Doesn't sport mode just bump the shift points up? When you are at 0 mph accelerating to 1 mph I don't think sport mode really comes into play and likewise, at least on our X3, sport mode does not eliminate the extreme jolt when trying to accelerate from 0 mph. No matter how we try to feather the throttle there is always a hard jolt as the drivetrain sorts itself out and tries to figure out how to gracefully go from a standstill to motion. It's embarrassing really. The rest of her X3 is so well sorted out though that we do try to really overlook the lurching. Did tons of Holiday travel over the last week, hit 15,000 miles over the weekend and still error code free!

Sport definitely impacts cornering and can provide a good amount of fun clipping apexes and exiting corners and when I get to drive her X3 I use this mode frequently. Sport even comes in handy in low speed maneuvers around parking lots and such.

[nonagon]

Originally Posted by n55x3

On our X3 the 'neutral drop' feeling is there regardless of being in sport or normal mode. Not sure how being in sport mode is really even applicable here. Doesn't sport mode just bump the shift points up? When you are at 0 mph accelerating to 1 mph I don't think sport mode really comes into play and likewise, at least on our X3, sport mode does not eliminate the extreme jolt when trying to accelerate from 0 mph. No matter how we try to feather the throttle there is always a hard jolt as the drivetrain sorts itself out and tries to figure out how to gracefully go from a standstill to motion.

Did you try Auto-H? There seems to be an amount of torque required to take it out of the hold and might mitigate that lurching you describe...although I don't even notice that at all, in Sport or Normal, Auto-H or not.

[lbjgh]

It looks like there is a fix for this design flaw.

Check out this product: http://www.bimmian.com/65/SPB/

[n55x3]

Yeah I mentioned in an earlier post that for whatever reason Auto-H seems to eliminate the lurch in most all cases. I am at a failure to explain why though. I am not sure if Auth-H uses brakes or some type of temp parking lock within the tranny or what. Anyone know?