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      11-27-2011, 03:55 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Lotus7 View Post
Please re-read posts no. 7 and no. 15. Your car won't start - It's not the end of the world. You either have a bad battery, a defective charging system or a computer error that's allowing the accessory systems to remain on when the car is parked.

Those components can fail on any car from any manufacturer (including Honda Civics). You may have been treated poorly by your dealer, but after all, it's a weekend and you have a dead battery. At least give them a chance to properly check the car before you declare that the sky is falling. Having a car not start is certainly an inconvenience, but, I repeat, it's not the end of the world.

We certainly sympathise with you and are sorry for your problems, but if you take some time and read a few of the past posts on this Forum (or any other vehicle specific on-line Forums), you will find that many people here have had much more serious problems and have had them corrected by their dealerships.

Your car didn't start, you probably have a dead battery. It's not like a wheel fell off at 80 mph. Panicking and over reacting will not get you very far in your situation. If you can't deal with a simple dead battery, I'd advise you to contact a lawyer immediately and find out what your options are for being released from your lease.

Sorry for the tone of this post. It's never fun when what should be a great experience turns sour, but there is an appropriate level of reaction and there is over-reaction to the point of non-effectiveness.

I wish you good luck, but again, please remember you're dealing with a very complex machine, and no machine made by man is ever perfect (except my orange Lotus).
I don't think asking for a brand new $50k car to at least start is over-reacting. He doesnt mention if he called the 800 number for service though.

And comparing apples to oranges is certainly not going to get him to understand that his brand new toy is dead.

I'd put the dealer on notice and give them exactly the given amount for lemon laws in their state.

I dont give BMW any sympathy as they always claim its the first time this has ever happened, blame the driver, or stall as long as possible until you give up.

My recommendation is as it always is:

Document every detail down to how long a conversation was, when it was, how it occured (e mail, phone, etc..)and what it was about.

Good Luck
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      11-27-2011, 05:53 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Evlengr View Post
I don't think asking for a brand new $50k car to at least start is over-reacting. He doesnt mention if he called the 800 number for service though.

And comparing apples to oranges is certainly not going to get him to understand that his brand new toy is dead.

I'd put the dealer on notice and give them exactly the given amount for lemon laws in their state.

I dont give BMW any sympathy as they always claim its the first time this has ever happened, blame the driver, or stall as long as possible until you give up.

My recommendation is as it always is:

Document every detail down to how long a conversation was, when it was, how it occured (e mail, phone, etc..)and what it was about.

Good Luck
AMEN!!!
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      11-28-2011, 06:35 AM   #25
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In terms of getting it started when it seems dead, did you place the key next to the painted mark on the right side of the steering column and try starting it then? Not that this would fix the overall problem, but if it works it could get you rolling again.

Confused about the "dead battery" situation but there's a light on your dash (no others it seems) and the alarm activates (w/o lights). Maybe it's a confused system rather than a drained one?
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      11-28-2011, 09:54 AM   #26
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If it were me, I would go to another dealership. The one you currently are using appears to be incompetent.
Good luck,
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      11-28-2011, 11:54 AM   #27
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Hi again! So today, monday, we have to go the dealership to fight for reversing the charges that they gave us. Remember, they charge us half of the diagnostic test which cost around $105+tax. And of course we still don't have the car for it is still stuck in new jersey where it broke down. we live in brooklyn so we don't want to waste our time again going there waiting for the tow truck to arrived. So in the dealership, we directly go to the manager because we want to talk about our problem... There were two of them, and one is a little bit pleasant, but the other was completely nasty/arrogant I should say... So again, we kept it secretly that our car broke down again because we really just want to prove that an ipod could not discharge the battery of the car since it just a month old. So we told them to explain the the diagnostic test that is really complicated to understand... Then they highlighted the result of their diagnostic test. He said that in Terminal 30B of the car, there is something that is plugged there that is draining the battery of the car... So they said it was an Ipod that drained the battery of the car.. . They argue with us that the car will keep on discharging its battery even if the engine is off if you plugged anything in your car, even an Ipod can totally drain the battery of the car... So again... I am still in disbelief... I told them that is a ridiculous design if it is true. It should shut off everything, no power should be in any terminal if the engine is off.. Again they said, that's how BMW is built... If I only knew this, I will never buy a BMW... It will cause me a lot of trouble in the future coz I always forget things plugged in the car....

Anyway... So I told them, OK, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that trully the Ipod is charging and will drain the battery of the car.... So now, we revealed our secret that THE CAR BROKE DOWN AGAIN. This is were we asked them to again explain how reliable the diagnosis was. Then we told them that we left the car in New Jersey last Saturday for BMW roadside assistance did not arrived, kept us waited for hours and they could not even bring it to their dealership in brooklyn for it is in a different state or interstate something... (I don't know how to explain.) THEY WERE SHOCKED.....
I told them that there is something wrong with the car, maybe you misdiagnosed it, or it may be a one of the defective cars of BMW.... Now this is where the nasty/arrogant manager, who really knew our case for he said he was the one who was checked our vehicle and was hands on to it, say sorry to us or apologize for the inconvenience...But again, he said that maybe there is something that we missed when they diagnose the car... (OMG, thank got is a car, and not a human being)... So then they calm down, and I calm down too for I know I was winning the case already... So here the pleasant manager took care of us... I asked them to handle the situation properly, pick up the car in New Jersey, and bring it to their dealership once again to diagnose the problem. I asked also for a loaner car for that's the only way they can serve us better this time, and my wife will not be able to work without a car.... So now they gave us a COUPE 323 which is I think a cool car... But I was still a bit disappointed with BMW for what happened to our car, and hope we can still return it.. But when I asked the manager, he said to me that there is no such thing as returning a car and it is not like buying a shirt in Macys and returning it after a month. So I think I'm stuck with it...If it breaks down again, I have to check the law about a lemon car....
We are planning to report this to BMW NA to have this investigated which I don't really know if they will, and would really asked them if an Ipod could kill the battery of the car so I can still leave my Ipod there plugged in all the time...
And regarding reversing the one they charge us, they still can't do it because they will still have to check the car first before they can do it.
Sorry guys if I wrote too long and too detailed... Next time I will tell you what is their diagnosis of the car....
Have a good day!!!! Thanks for all your advices
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      11-28-2011, 01:10 PM   #28
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Just some opposite perspective here. It seems a lot of people have given the OP some good advice, none of which appears to be followed.

It's hard to judge that the dealership is a total idiot since there has to be two sides to this story but who knows on this one. The reality is though that we are hearing one side of the story only. I don't know how the OP approached the dealership, but if this thread is any indication then I probably wouldn't be too inclined to help him much.

The cost of a car does not dictate that a component in the car will fail less. In fact, the opposite is usually true. The more "stuff" a car has in it, the more likely it is to have something go wrong. This is especially true in new cars due to premature components that fail that have not been put through the paces yet. Typically with electronics you will see failures occur in the first few months of operation and if they survive that then they usually will go for the long haul. Unfortunately the factory can't catch these types of failures and the new owner usually finds them. They are, however, fairly common with varying degrees of disturbance to the driver. Unfortunately it seems the OP has been hit with one that renders the car inoperative. That, in my opinion, is the crappy part.

I know lemon laws vary by state but it is typical that a car must experience 2-3 major issues before being declared a lemon. I would be surprised if a battery draining (if this is the true issue) is classified as a major issue. I know this can be subjective though.

Best of luck to you June, I hope you can get the issue worked out and enjoy the BMW.
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      11-28-2011, 01:12 PM   #29
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i notice in my car when i turn it off..i have to press the start button twice to shut off the engine and again because the radio is still on.. i dont know if its a feature or the way the car is setup...your probably not shutting off the car properly

i havent come across any problems on my 2012 x3 yet,
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      11-28-2011, 01:20 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyalpine90 View Post
i notice in my car when i turn it off..i have to press the start button twice to shut off the engine and again because the radio is still on.. i dont know if its a feature or the way the car is setup...your probably not shutting off the car properly

i havent come across any problems on my 2012 x3 yet,
Pressing twice is normal, "accessories" still on after first push, second push means all off.
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      11-28-2011, 01:29 PM   #31
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thanks for the info, my e90 was different once you press the start button everything was turn off..i guess it was like that because of the key fob insert hmmm

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Pressing twice is normal, "accessories" still on after first push, second push means all off.
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      11-28-2011, 02:14 PM   #32
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I can only assume from the OP's posts that not only has he not followed good advice provided here, but that he hasn't had the people at the dealer prove to him that it was his operational error that is the problem here.

Clearly the thing to do here is to try the exact same thing in the same model of car at the dealership keeping in mind that the accessory systems usually shut off after a certain period if left on without the engine running.

By the way, in my E90, the radio, etc. all shut off when you power down the engine. To get the accessories on without the engine running I have to press the start button without pushing in the clutch.
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      11-28-2011, 02:19 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyalpine90 View Post

thanks for the info, my e90 was different once you press the start button everything was turn off..i guess it was like that because of the key fob insert hmmm
Even if you press the button once, and the sound system is still playing tunes, it'll shut off in about 15 minutes or so. Or, if you lock the car after exiting, it shuts off (may be a feature of just the convenience package, though).
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      11-28-2011, 02:32 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Razel View Post
Even if you press the button once, and the sound system is still playing tunes, it'll shut off in about 15 minutes or so. Or, if you lock the car after exiting, it shuts off (may be a feature of just the convenience package, though).
It shuts off when you lock without CA too

Razel, have you ever been to the UK and looked at top shelf magazines in a newsagent?
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      11-28-2011, 04:09 PM   #35
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This thread caught my attention because we get what I think is the same warning message, but we haven't had any problems (yet).

If we let our 2011 35i sit overnight in the garage, for example, it will display a battery warning message when we start it in the morning, and a small warning message triangle will be displayed on the dash and continue to be displayed until we turn off the engine. When we restart the engine, anywhere from 1 - 30 minutes later, the warning message and triangle are gone.

When we take the vehicle in for its first service, I plan to ask them to look at this, as the message is disconcerting, but so far it doesn't seem to affect the operation of the vehicle.

Bruce
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      11-28-2011, 06:26 PM   #36
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The issue is overuse of Capslock. It's discharging the battery.

Seriously does the car still discharge the battery if nothing is connected?
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      11-28-2011, 07:25 PM   #37
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Razel, have you ever been to the UK and looked at top shelf magazines in a newsagent?
I've been to the UK a couple of times. Had to drive through the middle of London, even. With that much stress, I never got to the newsagent level.
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      11-28-2011, 08:06 PM   #38
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Just to give perspective to what Lotus mentions, I've had my X3 for almost a month now and since day 1 have plugged an ipod via USB in the centre console and have left it there since. I connect to it almost every time I drive, and haven't once have physically disconnected it and had no problems (knock on wood!!).

Lotus - I'm with you that it has an auto-shut off for accessories, but is this something that is outlined by BMW within the owners manual.

I'm willing to do a test....will keep you posted.
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      11-28-2011, 08:39 PM   #39
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Power cut off test!

So I just did a quick test. I have a yellow beacon that attaches to a cigarette lighter and plugged this in, turned off the vehicle and locked the vehicle and recorded this. It stopped working in about 3 minutes - so looks like it cuts off power a lot quicker than we thought!

I'll post the video as soon as I figure this out... Sak
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      11-28-2011, 08:52 PM   #40
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Lotus already caught me on the timer issue. In fact, I watched from the outside of my car as usb thumb drive with "Las Vegas" lights went out after the time elapsed.

Justed wanted to say thanks to Lotus for keeping these issues in proper perspective, as per an early post on this. Electrical problems in early cars were usually difficult to diagnosis, but the cars today are more like a desktop with wheels and an engine. Not only the wiring, but now the poor service tech has to deal with software. So the diagnosis of the problem is more difficult and a lot of the times a shot in the dark. The service people want to keep control of the customer and not look stupid so they treat us like we're dumb. Patience, perseverance and alcoholic beverages usually help.

BTW Lotus everytime I read your posts, for some reason I always think of one of my favorite TV shows, the "Big Bang Theory"!
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      11-28-2011, 09:47 PM   #41
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test..power cuts off in 3 min
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      11-28-2011, 10:55 PM   #42
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I think you guys should talk to them...educate them please... They don't believe me at all....I guess Im not the expert of this... They do admit that they have the most complex cars and they just don't know everything. They are the dealership service center in brooklyn.. Look it up then call them so they'll know coz I'm already tired of talking to them and explaining to them that it is not possible that an Ipod could discharge the battery of the car.... Like one of you here said, even if you left the Ipod on the car for a month, it would not discharge the car as long as you are using it everyday... I would understand if you didn't use the car for 3 weeks or more, maybe it's possible. I guess you should show them the video or have them test it, coz they are firm to me and they were told that way by BMW...that's what they said... They know better than me, So I don't know, there is nothing I can do with what they believe in...
But anyway, there is something wrong with my car for sure, coz after they diagnose the car, checked it and didn't find any problem with the battery, it broke down again, that's when I took the video... They said they might have missed something so I'll wait and see.... As of the moment, I'm enjoying the loaner car which they gave me... the COUPE is really great so that is something positive now... really fast... but I find the steering hard compared to the X3.. So I guess that's how it's built... So I might check that out in other thread here... but that's it.. overall great car...
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      11-28-2011, 11:01 PM   #43
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why not pick up a simple flashlight that plugs into your vehicle and perform this test and while you have the loaner perfom this test on it as well. Will take you less than 30 min and you may diagnose the problem quickly yourself.
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      11-29-2011, 12:26 AM   #44
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Best way to figure out the battery drain is to plug a dc clip on ammeter to the battery positive terminal. Measure the drain on your X3 and compare it any other healthy X3. You will get the clue.
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