[why13]

2011 X3 35 details
1) Msport is SAP with Aero kit and performance control( rear torque bias and electronic lsd/torque vectoring)
2) Msport and SAP have fixed sport supensions and by moving the rocker from Normal to Sport and Sport+, there is change in suspension hardness( sport is firmer than normal but it is a fixed damper setting in all modes ) , throttle sensivitivity, DSC limit and shift points
3) SAP or Msport with DHP gives you the flexibility of suspension adjusting to road and driving conditions both in normal and Sport modes. I think this is exactly like PASM in my previous Porsche where normal and sport have a dynamic range of firmness . Dhp also gives you VSS which is supposed to have more steering feel and firmness in Sport mode unlike the base fixed steering which i thougth was less in feel and firmness .-
4) 2011 X3 in U.S.A with no SAV , no Msport and no DHP still get the rocker switches to move from Normal to Sport and Sport +. I think this allows for change only in throttle , shift points and DSC limits and none to suspension or Steering
5) Did someone get std supensions with DHP ?

6) I think Msport with DHP is very appealing looks wise and is on par with SAP with DHP from a performance stand point.

Big question: Servotronic std steering VS Variable sport steering that is only available in DHP. WSJ review of 2011 x3 inidcates that VSS has a good feel and firms up well in sport mode, can anyone verify it? IMO std steering is a little un bmw like

I cannot belive BMW makes it so confusing to undertsand their options

Thanks in advance

[richardew]

It is very confusing. I just ordered a car with DHP, SAP and 19" wheels w/mixed performance tires. This gives me performance control, dynamic damper control and variable sport steering. If I were to add the M sport package it would only cost an additional $1050. It knocks out the SAP and 19" wheels as these are included in the M sport package. The M sport package also cancels the sport suspension (225 sprt suspension delete). ???
As far as I can tell, the only thing the M package gives you that you can't order alone is the aero package and the availability of carbon black paint. I'm still on the fence as to whether or not to get the M package also. I have another day or two to decide.

[tagz]

It is funny, but when I chose SAP over M Sport, I did not have a complete understanding of the features. The reason I chose SAP was that I liked the 309 wheels a lot better than the M sport ones..

[Le Chef]

My understanding is that without DHP the suspension has one fixed setting - no adjustments at all.

[nonagon]

Originally Posted by richardew

...As far as I can tell, the only thing the M package gives you that you can't order alone is the aero package and the availability of carbon black paint...

It also should be mentioned the wheels and tires are different, and in a square setup as opposed to staggered, and I've heard the 'sports suspension delete' gives a softer ride in DHP's Normal mode. Plus M Sport gives you an anthracite headliner, aluminum left footrest and various M badges. I'm probably missing a feature or too...

[Want the thrill]

#4 is not correct.

[Mako]

Originally Posted by nonagon

It also should be mentioned the wheels and tires are different, and in a square setup as opposed to staggered, and I've heard the 'sports suspension delete' gives a softer ride in DHP's Normal mode. Plus M Sport gives you an anthracite headliner, aluminum left footrest and various M badges. I'm probably missing a feature or too...

thicker steering wheel too (on their website, click back and fourth with the sport and M Sport and you can see it change). for $1,000 you basically get the M Wheels, M bumpers, M trim (which I would rather not have since its sort of implying the car is an M, Wheels are one thing but whats the point of the aluminum trim with M logos?) and anthracite headliner (which in another thread is supposed to be added to the sport activity package for 2012). It is a tough choice that I am going back and fourth on myself. especially since you can't get staggered wheels with M sport (maybe that will change with 2012 models)

[richardew]

thicker steering wheel too (on their website, click back and fourth with the sport and M Sport and you can see it change). for $1,000 you basically get the M Wheels, M bumpers, M trim (which I would rather not have since its sort of implying the car is an M, Wheels are one thing but whats the point of the aluminum trim with M logos?) and anthracite headliner (which in another thread is supposed to be added to the sport activity package for 2012). It is a tough choice that I am going back and fourth on myself. especially since you can't get staggered wheels with M sport (maybe that will change with 2012 models)

There dosen't seem to be any staggered wheel setup. As far as I can tell, the only way to get performance tires is with the 19" wheel option w/mixed performance tires. The M sport comes with "all season" (mediocre in the summer, mediocre in the winter, crappy in the snow) tires. I've only driven a demo with the M sport package with the thicker wheel. I don't think I'll miss it. Dito for the anthracite headliner. I can do without all the M logos and am not in love with the aero kit. I guess that's why I didn't spend the extra $1050. For me the only other decision is the heads up display.

[nonagon]

Originally Posted by richardew

There dosen't seem to be any staggered wheel setup. As far as I can tell, the only way to get performance tires is with the 19" wheel option w/mixed performance tires. The M sport comes with "all season" (mediocre in the summer, mediocre in the winter, crappy in the snow) tires. I've only driven a demo with the M sport package with the thicker wheel. I don't think I'll miss it. Dito for the anthracite headliner. I can do without all the M logos and am not in love with the aero kit. I guess that's why I didn't spend the extra $1050. For me the only other decision is the heads up display.

I hear you. I have the same issue with having all seasons instead of performance tires, and the fact that staggered setup on the SAP looks better...but I do like the look of the M Sport and the other M Sport features are worth the small increase in price to me.

[sfax]

It's often said that only a handful people of people alive on the planet today really understand quantum mechanics. The same can be said of BMW's SE/M Sport/DHP combinations

[Le Chef]

Judd Holland has written what maybe the definitive piece on DHP and all that. Search for his posts and you find it. I find it very helpful when speccing my wife's car.

[dhua]

Can you please post a link to Judd Holland's thread? Thanks.

[sfax]

Originally Posted by dhua

Can you please post a link to Judd Holland's thread? Thanks.

http://x3.xbimmers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=532984

[richardew]

I have the same issue with having all seasons instead of performance tires, and the fact that staggered setup on the SAP looks better

Is there a staggered setup with the SAP? I don't see it mentioned. In fact, I don't see any staggered wheel setup available with the X3.

[sfax]

Yes, mine are staggered: 19" 309s

[Mako]

Originally Posted by richardew

Is there a staggered setup with the SAP? I don't see it mentioned. In fact, I don't see any staggered wheel setup available with the X3.

I could be wrong but I think people (including myself) are viewing the "mixed" performance tires as meaning staggered.

[Le Chef]

If you check specs there are two versions of the 309 wheel setup available. "Square" with all season tires, and "staggered" with summer tires. On my wife's car I specced the latter and will add a set of 17" or 18" winter wheels and tires later in the year.

[richardew]

I could be wrong but I think people (including myself) are viewing the "mixed" performance tires as meaning staggered.

That's excellent. I've got the mixed performance tires on my order. I fell like a dope for not realizing that's what the mixed refers to. What's interesting is that if you order the M sport package on the website it knocks out the 19" mixed option and you end up with "square" all season tires. All that fluff (M badges, M steering wheel, M headliner, "aero" kit) but all season tires. I could not find optional tire sizes anywhere on the website, but could find them at tirerack.com.

[DaleWA]

#2 is not correct for M-Sport. M-Sport without DHP has the base suspension.

[mdavis]

M-sport provides a 60/40 torque split as well, I believe.

I ordered a 2012 w/M-sport...But it was a close call between SAP + DHP vs. M-sport + DHP...

[xDrive35i]

I'm not allowing this thread to continue. We have discussed this nineteen million times. USE THE SEARCH BUTTON