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      12-21-2011, 12:39 PM   #67
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i think there's nothing wrong with the original question. the op is saying he has no absolute categories beyond, i suppose, 4wheel or awd and a wagon/suv/cuv form factor. he is ready to consider luxury or non-luxury, being aware that there are benefits and costs [monetary or non-monetary] to each. same for handling, power, storage capacity and so on. ultimately only he can establish the subjective values which he attaches to a certain amount of money, a certain amount of luxury, and certain amount of driving-experience. only he can say whether he cares about the social perception of the brand. [like him, i don't. in fact, i would have preferred that a less "prestigious" brand - and a less expensive one - optimized my own algorithm. if subaru still made legacy gt maual wagons, i'd probably buy another. but they don't.] i think there is nothing wrong with throwing it all out there for discussion. i suggest that those who are offended by the very question should express their disapproval by not involving themselves in this discussion.
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      12-21-2011, 01:27 PM   #68
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I suppose it was to have a discussion about potential alternatives to the X3. I suspected this thread would elicit significant negative feedback, it is after all an X3 forum. Interestingly the RR Evoque discussion doesn't generate the same 'type' of discussion.

I listed the other cars we drove but it seems like I've really struck a nerve even suggesting that a Turbo Kia SX should even be mentioned in the same breath as an 'entry level' BMW SAV.

(IMO the X1 is a jacked up station wagon)

Quote:
Originally Posted by FASTTOYS View Post
??? ON THIS POST...
If this is trure why did you start this thread, just asking......
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      12-21-2011, 01:31 PM   #69
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My take on this thread is.............

It didn't belong on this forum. Threads like these are like an in grown hair, sure they are hair but they are irrittating and need to be removed.
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      12-21-2011, 01:50 PM   #70
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Hmm... anyone seen this one?





Seriously, if you drive them, you know.
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      12-21-2011, 02:25 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lbjgh View Post
I suppose it was to have a discussion about potential alternatives to the X3. I suspected this thread would elicit significant negative feedback, it is after all an X3 forum. Interestingly the RR Evoque discussion doesn't generate the same 'type' of discussion.

I listed the other cars we drove but it seems like I've really struck a nerve even suggesting that a Turbo Kia SX should even be mentioned in the same breath as an 'entry level' BMW SAV.

(IMO the X1 is a jacked up station wagon)
I'm sorry if others are giving you such negative feedback, tbh I'm sure you're just on here in order to get some opinions and a fair comparison between the cars you've listed. However, like you've said this is an X3 forum after all, although you would probably get the same type of treatment in a Kia forum the only difference is people would argue about different things such as the X3 being "overpriced", only d-bags drive it, or BMW drivers are trying to compensate for something.

The reason why you're getting so much crap for mentioning the Kia and not for the RR is because the thread is "hmm, now looking at a KIA...". Another reason is because all of the other cars you've listed are in the same market segment and price range as the X3, the Kia however is not. Kia has come a long way but there's nothing remotely premium or luxurious about Kias and to most people Kias are still seen as eco-boxes, something people buy because they can't afford something more expensive (not always the case, some people just want 4 wheels to get from A to B).

If value is what you're after I believe the Sportage is the right car for you, not an X3, Evoque, Q5, nor XC60 because you will always have to pay a premium for nicer things....you could buy a shirt from Walmart or you have one from a designer brand, both will keep you clothed and warm but most will opt for the nicer things in life if they have the ability.
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      12-21-2011, 07:02 PM   #72
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Guys, It's Christmas.
I'm not interested in bagging anyone or degrading anyone but I found the following amusing and I'm bored today so here goes...

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Originally Posted by powertech83 View Post
It's like asking a 5 yo which one taste better, Coke or Dom Perignon. Pointless.
LOL! But seriously, Ring child services - why would you give either of those toxic beverages to a 5yo?


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Originally Posted by lbjgh View Post
I'm at the age where I don't care what other's think about what I drive... that comes with maturity and self assurance.
If this was really true then I dont know why this post has gone on for so long... Its turning into a sad tennis volley.

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Originally Posted by jk View Post
i suggest that those who are offended by the very question should express their disapproval by not involving themselves in this discussion.
Peace on Earth everyone. And goodwill to all men (and women, and anyone who feels unfairly typecast in either of those categories).
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      12-22-2011, 02:51 AM   #73
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[QUOTE=lbjgh;11018214]I suppose it was to have a discussion about potential alternatives to the X3. I suspected this thread would elicit significant negative feedback, it is after all an X3 forum. Interestingly the RR Evoque discussion doesn't generate the same 'type' of discussion.

I listed the other cars we drove but it seems like I've really struck a nerve even suggesting that a Turbo Kia SX should even be mentioned in the same breath as an 'entry level' BMW SAV.

(IMO the X1 is a jacked up station wagon)[/Q

The RR is in a different class than a KIA. I also feel your Honda Accord is a step above a KIA, this is based off of Honda's reputation and longevity being an engineering company. I think a Fisher Price toy has higher end plastics than a Kia. Happy Holidays
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      12-22-2011, 09:07 AM   #74
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if you're considering the kia, you should really look at the rav4 with the bigger engine. if its rear door didn't open the wrong way it would have rated somewhat higher for me.
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      12-22-2011, 02:12 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lbjgh View Post
I guess the title should read "looking at a KIA again".

I'm in the market for a CUV and the first car I drove when I started looking was the Sportage SX (turbo 269hp).

I drove the following cars in the following order:

Sportage SX
RR Evoque
Audi Q5 3.2L 6cyl
RR Evoque
BMW X3 28i
Volvo XC60 T6
BMW X3 35i & 28i (back to back)
Sportage SX

I will admit the premium brands do have a slight edge over the KIA in 'feel' but after my second drive in the turbo KIA I think I'm more impressed now in the Korean car than when I first started looking.

Out of the bunch the X3 35i had the best driving dynamics but the throttle control/mapping would drive me bonkers (I think). I posted a couple of comments about the bimmer driving impressions in other threads.

The Q5 was the softest of the bunch and the RR was the looker. At the end of the day I am having a hard time justifying the $10K-$15K premium over the KIA.

Anyway, I think the KIA is back on the radar screen... It's too bad the the N20 isn't available in the X3.
I bet you get tons of mileage from the sales reps. I think it's great you are doing your homework but remember they have to earn a living...I wouldn't take a test drive if I had no intention of buying the car.
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      12-22-2011, 02:47 PM   #76
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Almost all manufacturers have a CUV/SAV in their model line up now days.

It's prudent to do one's homework and drive each vehicle that fits into a given criteria. I was seriously considering the RR Evoque but that all changed after driving the X3. I'm sure most sales associates understand comparison shopping and I was always honest and advised the associates that I was comparison shopping.

Are you saying you wouldn't test drive other makes and models before pulling the trigger on a $50K car? That would be more unusual than comparison shopping a KIA and a BMW.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBMk View Post
I bet you get tons of mileage from the sales reps. I think it's great you are doing your homework but remember they have to earn a living...I wouldn't take a test drive if I had no intention of buying the car.
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      12-22-2011, 02:57 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lbjgh View Post
I'm sure most sales associates understand comparison shopping and I was always honest and advised the associates that I was comparison shopping.
Nothing wrong with comparison shopping, in fact some car companies want you to own a car from a competing brand before buying theirs.

I remember my folks bought a Merc 2-3 months after I got my X3 and MB was offering a "conquest discount" of $1k on top of whatever incentives that they had at the time for switching to a MB over one of their 5-10 or so competing brands, Kia was not one of them but I remeber even Toyota was
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      12-22-2011, 05:02 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beyu View Post
Nothing wrong with comparison shopping, in fact some car companies want you to own a car from a competing brand before buying theirs.

I remember my folks bought a Merc 2-3 months after I got my X3 and MB was offering a "conquest discount" of $1k on top of whatever incentives that they had at the time for switching to a MB over one of their 5-10 or so competing brands, Kia was not one of them but I remeber even Toyota was
I think MB is offering free winter rims and Apple Ipad2...with purchase. I already picked up my BMW or I might be swayed. Nothing wrong with some extras.

As for the Landrover...the back is really squashed down...I think it was to accommodate the more "sportier" look. I would re-think that consideration unless you only really needed space for 2 people in the front. The rear feels claustrophobic and I am not considered a big person. The good thing about the Landrover is there are not many around. I hate to say it but the X3/X5s are maybe too popular.
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      12-22-2011, 07:19 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lbjgh View Post
Are you saying you wouldn't test drive other makes and models before pulling the trigger on a $50K car? That would be more unusual than comparison shopping a KIA and a BMW.
i ordered my first wrx before there was a single one in the country, and my turbo legacy when there wasn't one to try. i knew what i was getting in each case, and was happy with the result.

i figure that i'm used to driving what i'm driving. i've been driving a stick for 40 years, and would mostly feel awkward during a brief spell in a different vehicle. i could read a wealth of material on the internet, written by people who spend a lot of their time driving and thinking about cars. and then there are specs- acceleration, mileage, cargo volume, and so on. further, for the x3 in particular, there is its notorious tip-in issue which supposedly disappears after a longer time than any test drive.

so i did a lot of research, settled on the x3 and then went to a dealer to sit in one and decide if i wanted the sport seats and/or the hud. [yes and no, respectively]. i've still never driven an x3, and won't til my pcd in january. but as i said, this is neither the first nor the second time i've ordered a car without driving one.

so i guess maybe that's more unusual than comparing a bmw and a kia, but i did that too along the way, as well as looking at every other brand listed at edmunds. i'm looking forward to my drive home from so. carolina.
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      04-13-2012, 08:31 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbg2d View Post
True, but the Tiguan also is quite tuneable, 15 minutes at an APR shop adds 50hp. I tuned my old mkV GTI, the APR tune is switchable from the driver's seat and can be access coded. I never heard a peep out of my dealer's service people, just put it in stock mode and locked it.
@bbg2d - I'd like to know which APR tune you had. The wife just got a Tiguan and I would love the extra HP!
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