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      04-25-2012, 09:35 AM   #1
bluedevils
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I still don't understand the climate control

I have the controls set to auto and there are controls by the vents in the front and rear where I can dial hot (red) or cold (blue). On a cold day with the auto set to 72F and the dial set to cold (blue), I get cold air out of the vents. Reading the manual didn't help and my search of this forum didn't yield an answer.
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      04-25-2012, 09:50 AM   #2
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So the question is, what is the relationship of those hot/cold dials in relation to the auto temp and climate controls?
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      04-25-2012, 09:53 AM   #3
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The auto climate controls apply to all the vents. It adjusts where the air comes out and the temps based on some fuzzy logic.

The blue/red dials only apply to the dash vents. So say your AC is on and is blowing cold air but for some reason you don't like the cold air hitting your face. You can warm up the dash vents by turning the dial to red but the floor and or top dash vents would continue to blow cold air.

Works the other way too. Say you have the heater on and is blowing nice warm air at your feet but you don't want warm air blwoing at your face. You can fine tune the dash air temps with the dial.

Kinda gimicky but on the rare occasions I get to spend some time in the X3 I've used them and they seem to work.
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      04-25-2012, 09:58 AM   #4
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The blue/red thumbwheel is a great way to fine tune temp. Over many years of BMW ownership I've simply set temp to 22C and then fine tuned via the thumbwheel.
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      04-25-2012, 09:59 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n55x3 View Post
The auto climate controls apply to all the vents. It adjusts where the air comes out and the temps based on some fuzzy logic.

The blue/red dials only apply to the dash vents. So say your AC is on and is blowing cold air but for some reason you don't like the cold air hitting your face. You can warm up the dash vents by turning the dial to red but the floor and or top dash vents would continue to blow cold air.

Works the other way too. Say you have the heater on and is blowing nice warm air at your feet but you don't want warm air blwoing at your face. You can fine tune the dash air temps with the dial.

Kinda gimicky but on the rare occasions I get to spend some time in the X3 I've used them and they seem to work.
Thanks! I always wondered what they were for too on my E90
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      04-25-2012, 11:56 AM   #6
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Thank you, this is how I figured it worked, but I thought it odd. I'll try to use the thumbwheel to fine tune the temp, but I wish they added a defeat button so that the auto temp could be the one and only control. On the surface it seems to archaic to go back to an analog thumbwheel, but maybe I will find this setup to be invaluable.
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      04-25-2012, 01:09 PM   #7
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It seems that the Auto button controls the temperature (and I guess which vents the air comes out of ) but not the fan speed. Stupid design. In my SC 430, if I have it on Auto, it controls everything: temp, vents, & fan speed.
BMW also needs to add an OFF button.
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      04-25-2012, 01:20 PM   #8
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There is an off button, just not labled accordingly. If you press the fan speed down button it will cycle through the fan speeds until you go past the slowest fan speed and at that point it kills the HVAC. All HVAC display will go dark.

Also, while not 100% certian, on a recent hot day I *thought* I cold hear the fan speed speed up when we first started the X3, then as the interior cooled the fan speed slowed. All the while only ever showing the fan speed setting = 1.

I agree, it is kind of odd. On our other vehicles with auto climate control the fan speed graphic would actually show higher or lower speeds rather than staying locked into a specific speed.
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      04-25-2012, 01:34 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n55x3 View Post
There is an off button, just not labled accordingly. If you press the fan speed down button it will cycle through the fan speeds until you go past the slowest fan speed and at that point it kills the HVAC. All HVAC display will go dark.

Also, while not 100% certian, on a recent hot day I *thought* I cold hear the fan speed speed up when we first started the X3, then as the interior cooled the fan speed slowed. All the while only ever showing the fan speed setting = 1.

I agree, it is kind of odd. On our other vehicles with auto climate control the fan speed graphic would actually show higher or lower speeds rather than staying locked into a specific speed.
There should be a dedicated off button for climate control. Every other auto that I have had in the past had one. Only my 2002 325ic and this 2012 x3 have this dum design of having to constantly lower the fan speed to shut it off.
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      04-25-2012, 01:37 PM   #10
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My question regarding the climate control is something I've seen in the past but never seen fully answered. I will revisit the subject to see if anyone has insight (or if things have just changed):

On my previous BMWs ('01 330i; '08 335i Convertible) when I hit the AUTO button - whether I'm trying to get the car warm because it's cold outside or get the car cooled down because it's hot outside - the fan speed would automatically start out high and then slowly work itself down to low once the interior temperature was reached. This would happen each time I got in the car and started it. The climate control would do just that - get the climate under control in the most economical way possible. (Just to clarify: With the AUTO button on, the car would automatically do all the changes to the fan speed -> high at the beginning and then incrementally lower itself until temperature set and I never touched anything.)

On my X3, having AUTO ON does nothing to the fan speed. The ONLY way the fan speed will change is if I manually hit the speed settings to increase/decrease.

Anyone have different results with their X3? I'm looking for the same results as my previous cars. Yes, I know I can turn up the fan all the way when I get in the car but that's not what I'm asking. Especially since the manual on the previous cars states that the climate control automatically figures out the best way to heat/cool the car.

In all the scenarios listed above, it does not matter whether the A/C is on or not. (Side Note: In ALL 3 cars I've ALWAYS had the A/C on no matter whether I'm heating or cooling the car.)
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      04-25-2012, 02:06 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dudley07726 View Post
There should be a dedicated off button for climate control. Every other auto that I have had in the past had one. Only my 2002 325ic and this 2012 x3 have this dum design of having to constantly lower the fan speed to shut it off.
My 2003 audi did not have a dedicated off switch. It behaved in the same way my current X3 does.
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      04-25-2012, 03:00 PM   #12
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In my 2009 X3, the AUTO ON auto adjusted the fan speed. Like you mentioned - would start of really high on a hot day and then gradually decrease as the cabin got cooler. In my 2012 X3, the AUTO doesn't adjust the fan at all.

I actually like the blue/red thumbwheel a lot. I usually keep my temp at 68 but sometimes I want some cooler or warmer air to come out of the top but not change the cabin temperature. It's really convenient.

Also, I don't mind the lack of on/off for the climate control. 95% of the time it's on in my car and I imagine that to be the case of most people who don't own convertibles or constantly drive with their windows down. Turning down the fan to turn it of was how it was in my previous X3s. Personally and selfishly, there are enough buttons on my dash so I'm ok with the lack of one.

To be honest, don't quite a few cars still have the same convention? If you wanted the AC/heater off, you turned the knob for the fan all the way down. Otherwise, you turn it up and adjust the intensity, and then adjust the temperature knobs. If you want the AC on, there was a separate button for that. However, I think I do recall driving Impalas (biz travel Hertz a lot) and there is an on/off button...
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      04-25-2012, 06:31 PM   #13
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What I have found is that Auto does vary the fan speed up to the maximum set by the position of the fan speed setting. I agree that Auto should control the fan speed as well, but I generally put it to 2 or 3 and that works fine. The manual says:

"With the AUTO program switched on, automatic control of the air volume and air distribution can be adjusted. Press the left or right side of the button: decrease or increase the intensity. The selected intensity is shown on the display of the automatic climate control."

As to a separate Off switch - on just about every car I have ever owned, turning the fan right down to 0 turns the HVAC off... my VW that I had last was the first one that actually had an Off button. For the number of times that it gets used I think calling it "dum" is a little harsh. From a UI and ergonomics perspective why have an unnecessary button, when it's rarely called function can be intuitively called by adding a function to another button?

Last edited by swallowtail; 04-25-2012 at 06:37 PM..
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      04-25-2012, 07:46 PM   #14
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I think there is some degree of fan speed throttling done by the auto climate control. The other day I just got in my car after it was sitting in the hot sun (climate control set to Auto, 68 degrees, lowest fan speed) and the fan ran faster for a few minutes before the temp finally dropped. Afterwards it settled down to barely audible levels.
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      04-25-2012, 07:59 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n55x3
The auto climate controls apply to all the vents. It adjusts where the air comes out and the temps based on some fuzzy logic.

The blue/red dials only apply to the dash vents. So say your AC is on and is blowing cold air but for some reason you don't like the cold air hitting your face. You can warm up the dash vents by turning the dial to red but the floor and or top dash vents would continue to blow cold air.

Works the other way too. Say you have the heater on and is blowing nice warm air at your feet but you don't want warm air blwoing at your face. You can fine tune the dash air temps with the dial.

Kinda gimicky but on the rare occasions I get to spend some time in the X3 I've used them and they seem to work.
Not just for the dash vents. The vents in the back seat of my car also have the dial. It's right next to the dial that controls the vent opening.

The dials, unlike the knobs on the center console, allow you to control your air temperature directly based on how it feels. Want the compressor on but you're suddenly too cold? Keep the knobs at the preselected temp and just move the dial towards the red.
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      04-25-2012, 08:15 PM   #16
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Note that AUTO is only there to automatically distribute the air to any and all of the three air direction modes, which should be on the driver's side of the driver's temperature knob. Press any of those three and AUTO will deactivate, thus distributing all of the air as to any combination of the three directional buttons: upwards, towards the middle, or from the footwells. With AUTO off, the fan speed can be adjusted more precisely; I believe there are eight levels. When AUTO is on, there are only five fan speed levels, which is to suggest that the climate control computer is using your selection of any one of the five levels as an equilibrium point from which the fan speed will be automatically increased or decreased depending on cabin conditions and selected temperature. For further adjustment, BMW has provided you with vent slat dials to adjust the size of the opening of any of the dash or rear passenger vents (there are four in front and two in back), as well as arbitrarily marked, perception-based HOT/COLD dials not unlike those you use to control the temperature of your shower.
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      04-26-2012, 12:16 AM   #17
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The dash temp dial vs auto control - I always wandered about that in BMWs.
Usually I drive with that dial in the neutral middle position, but that might actually result in heating.
It's simply an outdated stupid design from pre-A/C days that leads to conflicting user input.
Btw, same in the back. And it's annoying. Have to check it all the time if someone played around and the thing heating.

So which button dominates?
And with A/C off down on the climate control, but with the dash dial set all the way to cold - does the A/C get activated again without the control light going on?
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      04-26-2012, 12:37 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RSchneider View Post
And with A/C off down on the climate control, but with the dash dial set all the way to cold - does the A/C get activated again without the control light going on?
That one I can answer... a/c is only on when the * button is pressed. A/C will cause the engine to restart from a start/stop event once cabin temperature rises too high as it needs to run the a/c compressor. Never happens with the dial turned low but the a/c off.
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      04-26-2012, 02:32 AM   #19
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It's interesting to hear of the differing reactions to the A/C controls. I love the setup. I set my target A/C temp to 22C and then fine tune via the thumbwheel. The thumbwheel is infinitely variable between limits, it doesn't move in 0.5C increments (it's beautifully analogue!) and can be easily tweaked without taking my eyes of the road. Changing the main dial(s) by say 1C or 1.5C results in greater driver distraction. I never need to change the 22C setting, as far as I'm concerned BMW could put the target temp setting on the iDrive, those temp dials and display are not needed and clutter the dash.
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      04-26-2012, 02:40 AM   #20
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I've had a blue/red adjustment knob in every car I have every owned, including my current two beemers.
Many of these did not have airconditioning, let alone climate control.

In all the early ones, the blue end of the scale simply meant that the outside air was being directed to the vents (unless you pressed the recirculate switch / button).
This outside air always passed over a secondary radiator (about the size of a VHS video cassette - you younger folk can google it)
WHen the blue position was set, there was no water flow into the radiator so the air was simply at outside temperatiures.

The red end of the scale simply meant the air heating radiator was turned on, and hot water from the main radiator was diverted into the air heating radiator so that the outside air was heated before it came into the cabin.
Adjusting the knob merely adjusted the water flow.

I cant say for sure this is what it still does, but even on cars with A/C (my 91 corolla comes to mind) the secondary radiator was still in place behind the dash. (it leaked and had to be replaced under warranty)

I would not be at all surprised to hear that this feature still exists in modern A/C and CC cars, to give owners an air warming option when their A/C or CC compressor is turned off. (to save fuel or simply because some people don't like canned air)

It therefore has always struck me as strange when I see someone set the CC to cool a car and then adjust the knob to red and start to warm the air from the radiator, thus making the A/C work harder.

As far as I know, the interior temp sensor and the light intensity sensor are the only two inputs into the control algorithms of the CC (plus of course the desired temp settings on the dash).

The Red/Blue adjustment is separate and can either help heat a car if you want to heat it, or just acts conterproductively if you are trying to cool a car.

Looking at RealOEM - surprise surprise - the heating radiator is installed in the F25 X3...
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      04-26-2012, 05:16 AM   #21
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When your HVAC is set to Auto, with the fan on say halfway, does the fan speed change if you slowly move the temperature control (the digital one, not the red blue vertical dial in between the vents) from 16 through current room temp through to 28 or so?
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      04-26-2012, 05:45 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swallowtail View Post
When your HVAC is set to Auto, with the fan on say halfway, does the fan speed change if you slowly move the temperature control (the digital one, not the red blue vertical dial in between the vents) from 16 through current room temp through to 28 or so?
I've not tried that but if the fan speed is too low to get the cabin down to temp the fan speed will be boosted above the setting you've made.
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