[Roundown]

Originally Posted by martin mustang

I totally agree with your conclusions, my post was more of a statement of frustration, and also to see if many X cars are of the same, I know for a fact that the old X3 was a mess and was also built by Karman outside BMW hence all the issues yet you hear some folks with less problems with the old one than with the F25, as for your argument on Audis I believe they most over-priced premium cars based on the engineering behind them, a timing belt instead of timing chain, costing the same as rear wheel drive Mercs and BMs is simply not on, they do share all part with Skodas, Seats and VWs priced well below, the one sign of all with the old models was always how VW group regardless if you went for a Lombo, Porsche or Audi never bothered to move the hand brakes to the driver side for us driving on the right hand side, BMW always moved the hand brake to the driver side, this was for me a simple sign of cost cutting from Audi to see it in 911s was truly shocking.

Having owned an E83 and now an F25 (both an LCI and pre-LCI), the F25 is miles better from a quality perspective. PM and I'll send you my service records... BMW built Spartanburg in part because of QC issues with third-party suppliers (like Kharman).

Honestly- just sounds like you're unlucky. Your wheels were made in Poland, your speakers in China and your wiring loom, likely somewhere in between. None of the issues- other than perhaps a ground fault caused by assembly error (which is a major stretch, did you try replacing the bulb) can be blamed on the factory...they're better leveled at the engineers (in Germany).

FWIW- I've also owned an F15 X5 (see my post history) and while its materially more luxurious than the F25, my wife and I couldn't get over the how big, heavy and poorly dampened it was (we were on the base steel springs, not EDC or DHP).

As others have suggested, take an extended test drive.

[plymjack]

Originally Posted by gIzzE

I reckon it sounds more like you have a crap dealer.

Three very easy faults to rectify to keep you happy that they are not doing.

Absolutely...

[martin mustang]

Originally Posted by plymjack

Absolutely...

Very good point, they did work for getting my alloys changed after warranty with BMW at no charge, but I guess this was always a BMW call not the dealer.

[cs32]

Some of these are not problems that can be blamed on X being built outside of Germany. The problem you had with the transmission being fixed with a software update is not a hardware problem but a software one. Unless they physically damaged the transmission at the plant and found some way to fix your one off issue with software, it would be much more cost effective to replace the transmission than to pay software developers hours to create a fix for your specific case. I would assume that there would be no difference between your transmission and one in any other X-drive BMW makes, so most likely this affected all cars.

I have had a 1998 3 series, a 2003 Z4, and 2015 X3 (still own the letter cars) and the 3 and Z both had speaker problems, all on the driver's side, all intermittent (only when it was very cold outside which for Seattle is rare), and usually fixed by turning the radio off and back on. The 3 was made in Germany, the Z and X in South Carolina. It could be a problem with how the wiring was set, a problem with the stereo, or any other number of reasons. But my experience has shown that it is not where it was manufactured.

Alloys rusting I would not expect to be manufacturing plant specific. They would use a specific ratio of metals, I doubt it would change depending on where the car is assembled, and I doubt the wheels are even made in South Carolina, but rather some plant far off that sources wheels for all plants.

Many of the parts are the same among all BMW cars and sourced from one specific manufacturer and one manufacturing point. Sure, a X3 wheel may be different than the wheel on a Z4 in size, shape, etc, but they are made of the same materials and most likely from the same source. It is how they reduce prices, if they buy 10 million wheels from Joe's Wheels, they are going to get a discount. Same with the brakes, they may be a different size and shape, but there is not going to be a difference between an X3 and a Z4 brake. Now this doesn't hold for a X3 brake and an M5 brake, because there are different requirements (track vs. street driving). But for the general case they are all going to be the same.

Some items like the window pop you hear, the light bulb not being seated properly, sure those could be manufacturing defects, but I am not sure these would be specific to that plant, problems happen everywhere. And for the light bulb, if your car was a 2011, and after 4 years it became dislodged it is not good, but with use things like that happen.

[martin mustang]

Originally Posted by cs32

Some of these are not problems that can be blamed on X being built outside of Germany. The problem you had with the transmission being fixed with a software update is not a hardware problem but a software one. Unless they physically damaged the transmission at the plant and found some way to fix your one off issue with software, it would be much more cost effective to replace the transmission than to pay software developers hours to create a fix for your specific case. I would assume that there would be no difference between your transmission and one in any other X-drive BMW makes, so most likely this affected all cars.

I have had a 1998 3 series, a 2003 Z4, and 2015 X3 (still own the letter cars) and the 3 and Z both had speaker problems, all on the driver's side, all intermittent (only when it was very cold outside which for Seattle is rare), and usually fixed by turning the radio off and back on. The 3 was made in Germany, the Z and X in South Carolina. It could be a problem with how the wiring was set, a problem with the stereo, or any other number of reasons. But my experience has shown that it is not where it was manufactured.

Alloys rusting I would not expect to be manufacturing plant specific. They would use a specific ratio of metals, I doubt it would change depending on where the car is assembled, and I doubt the wheels are even made in South Carolina, but rather some plant far off that sources wheels for all plants.

Many of the parts are the same among all BMW cars and sourced from one specific manufacturer and one manufacturing point. Sure, a X3 wheel may be different than the wheel on a Z4 in size, shape, etc, but they are made of the same materials and most likely from the same source. It is how they reduce prices, if they buy 10 million wheels from Joe's Wheels, they are going to get a discount. Same with the brakes, they may be a different size and shape, but there is not going to be a difference between an X3 and a Z4 brake. Now this doesn't hold for a X3 brake and an M5 brake, because there are different requirements (track vs. street driving). But for the general case they are all going to be the same.

Some items like the window pop you hear, the light bulb not being seated properly, sure those could be manufacturing defects, but I am not sure these would be specific to that plant, problems happen everywhere. And for the light bulb, if your car was a 2011, and after 4 years it became dislodged it is not good, but with use things like that happen.

I agree with you, I guess it is more down to bad luck and the fact that our X3 was one of the early ones, the Alloys corrosion impacted a specific type and here in Ireland at least one other car with same type and year had the same experience, so likely to be down to a bad batch, as it was our 1st X car I was checking if others shared the same conclusion, I did see often comments about X cars not being up to standards! after all some of the worst BMW come from Germany Karmann division, when researching my 635 CSI I come to the conclusion it was best to buy a 1988 version as the 6 series production was moved to BMW in house from Karmann and many earlier models suffered serious rust due to the source of production.

[martin mustang]

Originally Posted by Ultbruin

Maintenance, warranty likely different for Ireland.

It's 3 years, I believe any extra years in Europe it's normally setup by local dealers networks! on the warranty side, BMW was happy to change my Alloys after warranty expired the dealer put the case that we have a history of buying from them!

[martin mustang]

Originally Posted by cSurf

Having owned an E83 and now an F25 (both an LCI and pre-LCI), the F25 is miles better from a quality perspective. PM and I'll send you my service records... BMW built Spartanburg in part because of QC issues with third-party suppliers (like Kharman).

Honestly- just sounds like you're unlucky. Your wheels were made in Poland, your speakers in China and your wiring loom, likely somewhere in between. None of the issues- other than perhaps a ground fault caused by assembly error (which is a major stretch, did you try replacing the bulb) can be blamed on the factory...they're better leveled at the engineers (in Germany).

FWIW- I've also owned an F15 X5 (see my post history) and while its materially more luxurious than the F25, my wife and I couldn't get over the how big, heavy and poorly dampened it was (we were on the base steel springs, not EDC or DHP).

As others have suggested, take an extended test drive.

Thanks for your interesting feedback on the X5, one advantage of the X3 by many reports was the driving feels how not all lost to the physics of SUV’s, my wife certainly miss the 3 series in that respect.
On our luck I do believe the fact our X3 was an early car out of the chain never helped, in fact when changing my cars I always made the jump after at least a year in production, partly waiting for the M kit but also knowing it is common to have early production cars subject to issues and all!

[m_alnimah]

Well, it's well known that when BMW releases a new car for a while there will be issues until they're all figured out (about a year after release) Luckily when I bought my 2011 535i i had no issues until about a month since i sold it, the car turned into a psychopath whose battery is charged and refuses to start and let me in, after all that still my favorite Bimmer

[exon]

I think the x3 are alright on the major components. Interior build quality could be better, but overall it is okay.

My previous e60 interior is less nice but more solidly built. However its engine needed a repair on the valves.

F30 does not seem to be too good though, interior seems a bit loose over bumps...

F10 is very well built, calm and solid all the time. Feels like a tank, (drives like a tank too: not good).