[GFK007]

Any info on when this will actually release?

I've had two f25s and my lease is due in September. I'll consider the new x3 if it means extending the lease a few months.

Otherwise, I'll have to go elsewhere...

[brissim]

Do a search. I recall a relatively recent thread on this subject. From memory the informed opinion was that we wouldn't see the next generation G01 X3 until the second half of 2017 at the earliest.

Tony

[Commerce]

Someone on this forum mentioned a document said the end of production date for the F25 is June 2017 meaning the car will likely debut near the end of 2017 or beginning of 2018.

[drewxnyc]

Originally Posted by GFK007

Any info on when this will actually release?

I've had two f25s and my lease is due in September. I'll consider the new x3 if it means extending the lease a few months.

Otherwise, I'll have to go elsewhere...

Hey GFK007,

On another forum they mentioned that BMW is still making MY 2017 F25 X3's this year (starts production in Apr 2016) which will most likely be the last of it. So I think the MY 2018 G01 X3's will be available Q3/Q4 of 2017. My local BMW CA suspects the same as well.

[GFK007]

Yikes. Okay - that'll probably push me to consider the GLC or maybe an x5 if the deal is enticing enough. Other option is a Jeep GC - which in my opinion is a great bang for the buck.

[double_j]

Post a reply to let us know how the Jeep GC checks out. I didn't really think about it as an option until after I got my X3 but now regret not at least test driving one beforehand (especially since the X3 helped me to realize that I value comfort way more than I thought I did for my daily driver).

The Jeep will be a bit slower and thirstier (with the V8) but will definitely make up ground in terms of comfort, pricing, and tech. For the same money as my X3, I likely could have gotten into a V8 Summit model.

[GFK007]

Originally Posted by double_j

Post a reply to let us know how the Jeep GC checks out. I didn't really think about it as an option until after I got my X3 but now regret not at least test driving one beforehand (especially since the X3 helped me to realize that I value comfort way more than I thought I did for my daily driver).

The Jeep will be a bit slower and thirstier (with the V8) but will definitely make up ground in terms of comfort, pricing, and tech. For the same money as my X3, I likely could have gotten into a V8 Summit model.

Exactly - I'll be pricing out a summit, and the fit and finish looks to be excellent for this price point...

Will revert back. I understand the GC is due for a face lift soon.

[bailyhill]

Have you guys driven one yet? Not sure it will do it for you if you love your X3. I would like to know.

[double_j]

I got a chance to test drive a couple of Jeep Grand Cherokees this weekend. Thoughts below. Note that I'm going to keep the comparison to the X3 I have vs. the Jeep I tested for the sake of simplicity. Discussion about how different options packages or aftermarket fixes could affect the outcome (for example, RFT vs. non-RFT) would branch off to a million possibilities where I don't really want to go.

TL;DR – Take a good look at the 2015/2016 Jeep GC in Summit Trim with the V8 when shopping for a small to mid-size SUV. It's slower and less sporty than the 2016 X3 xdrive35 but it more than makes up for it in terms of interior fit and finish and overall comfort. It really all comes down to your prioritization of sport vs. comfort. FCA has put together a pretty impressive contender overall.

Vehicles compared:

2016 BMW X3 xdrive35: Tech, cold weather, premium, driver assistance plus, xLine. Sticker price of ~$58K.

2015 Jeep Grand Cherokee Summit Edition (new, non-demo): 5.7L V8, California package ($1000 option, exterior trim changes), brown/black interior combo ($500 option). Sticker price of ~$58K. I test drove the 2015 in the hopes the dealer would be willing to heavily discount the prior year holdover. They weren't. Changes for the 2016 model year are limited to slightly better mileage estimates (20mpg highway vs. 22 mpg) due to a greater use of aluminum in the suspension or something like that.

Note about the Jeep option scheme: the Summit is the Grand Cherokee's top-level trim package. It comes 'standard' with all tech/drive train toys available. The only options on the Summit trim are engine (v6, v6 diesel, v8), an exterior trim package ($1000), a brown/black interior leather combo ($500), and a dual screen rear seat entertainment system (~$2000, I honestly didn't think people still wanted these since tablets can be had for so cheap nowadays).

About me: I have a 2016 X3 xdrive35 for my daily driver. Since I also have a dedicated weekend car, the X3 is used mainly for commuting (75 miles a day in a combination of freeway and stop/go traffic), weekend errands, and drives into the pot-hole-ridden city. While I do like to blast around on & off ramps as much as the next guy, I will admit to a newly discovered bias towards comfort in this context since most of my X3 driving is mindless & utilitarian. The X3 is my third BMW (e46 M3 and E90 M3 were the others).

On-road performance: Predictably, the Jeep was much ‘softer’ than the X3 in normal driving. Steering was accurate if a touch numb and the suspension soaked up bumps much better than the X3. The V8 felt strong at low speeds - I forgot how nice it is to have a normally aspirated V8 in today’s world of 4 and 6 cylinder turbos. Passing oomph at 50 mph was more than adequate but I didn’t get a chance to see how strong it would pull at highway speeds of 70+. Though I didn’t feel the v8 to be lacking in low end grunt, there’s no debating the fact that the Jeep is slower than the X3 (6.5 0-60 for the Jeep vs. 5.3 for the X3). I’m not sure how FCA managed it, but the Jeep is slower to 60 than even a full-sized Cadillac Escalade or GMC Yukon.

That said, the ‘instant on’ torque of the naturally aspirated V8 is the Jeep’s savior and I never felt to be lacking for power from a stop up to 50-60mph. Overall, the Jeep isn’t the most exciting handler out there but it does move with confidence and it never felt excessively soft or mattress-y despite its lean towards comfort. It’s very easy to drive and gives a ride without any sharp edges. Not exciting but not offensive.

The BMW’s ride is someone jarring by comparison though with the stiffer suspension, more direct steering feel, and stronger engine, it’s definitely the handler of the two.

At the end of the day, on-road performance is a toss-up. It totally depends on your prioritization of comfort vs. sport.

Gas usage: surprisingly closer than you’d think. The Jeep V8 gets 14mpg city and 20mpg highway (17 combined) on regular gas (increased to 22mph for the 2016 model); the BMW gets 19mpg city and 26mpg highway (21 combined) on premium grade. In my area, a gallon of regular costs about $2 and a gallon of premium about $2.40. The lower cost per gallon offsets quite a bit of the extra consumption meaning that the Jeep may only end up costing you an extra 5% at the pump (something like $1.50 per fill up?). Range for each is equivalent – the Jeep actually covers more miles per tank due to its 24 gallon capacity.

Interior: Holy cow. Jeep wins vs. the X3 hands down. If the X3’s interior can be described as ‘technical & austere’, the Jeep’s interior can be described as ‘functionally luxurious’. Seats and dash are covered in a gorgeous saddle-colored (and thick-feeling) leather, with soft touch matte ‘wood’ pieces and a suede-like headliner. Jeeps seats are wider and less bolstered than the X3 (comfort vs. sporting) and there’s more room overall for driver and passenger (both side to side and front to back legroom). In general, the Jeep cabin feels open and airy vs. the X3’s slightly claustrophobic vibe. (I’m 6’3” and 220lbs and I find the X3’s seats to be too narrow and short with pedal placement a little too close for my tastes). Both vehicles have a panoramic sunroof.

I think it’s valid to say that I question the longevity of the Jeep interior vs. the BMW (those leathers and cloth headliners are likely more susceptible to dirt and wear) but the Jeep to BMW comparison makes clear to me how much ground BMW needs to make up in terms of interior design/materials, especially if they want to stay competitive with MB and Audi. The Jeep cabin was a much nicer and comfortable place to be than the X3. This means a lot to me since I spend between 12 to 13 hours per week in the car on my commute.

One odd note – despite the Jeep’s larger size, I did not notice an appreciable difference in either cargo room or back seat space vs. the X3. I expected to see more rear leg room at the very least, but I wonder if they used whatever extra space they had on the front row only. Since I usually drive solo and don’t yet have kids this isn’t a big deal for me. Just something you might want to check out if looking for a family vehicle.

Toys and Bells/Whistles: Total toss up. Both pretty much have the same stuff. I lean towards the Jeep as I think that the tech offered is a little more practical (e.g., ventilated seats are awesome in our NE summers, and active cruise control is a big help in stop & go traffic).

Key things the BMW has that the Jeep didn’t: HUD, front and side cameras, auto hold, foot activated tailgate.

Key things the Jeep had that the BMW doesn’t: Remote start, tailgate closure via key fob, ventilated seats, active cruise control

The Summit version of the Jeep GC also comes with an adjustable air suspension that can raise or lower the truck for ground clearance between 6” and 11”and with a drive mode selector for the full-time 4 wheel drive system (include a low range and downhill mode). Since I don’t do any serious off-roading, I viewed these more as novelties than anything else. In fact, for most of us it can probably be argued that these are needless complications that will invariably cost money to fix at some point in the future. Also, if you’re looking to do some real off-roading, I’m guessing the X3 wouldn’t be on your shopping list anyway.

Bottom line – the Jeep GC Summit V8 was a really nice surprise. I like it a lot and think that people would do themselves a disservice by automatically ruling it out of consideration. It definitely doesn’t have the BMW’s driving dynamics but it easily outclasses the X3 in terms of interior quality and comfort. Given my priorities, I think the Jeep is the better vehicle for me. In fact, I really would have left the dealership in one save for the fact that I just got the X3 in October and would have to swallow a whole lot of depreciation to get out of it this soon. Oh well, lesson learned. #firstworldproblems

[The X Men]

The Grand Cherokee is a nice SUV but it is a much bigger SUV than the X3, 7" longer and 3" wider, The Grand Cherokee should really be compare to the X5, Mercedes GL or the Audi Q7.

[MichiganMike]

Another point to consider, Consumer Reports rates the reliability of the Grand Cherokee as Poor at 67% worse than average. The same source rates the BMW X3 as Good at 8% above average for reliability.

[double_j]

Originally Posted by The X Men

The Grand Cherokee is a nice SUV but it is a much bigger SUV than the X3, 7" longer and 3" wider, The Grand Cherokee should really be compare to the X5, Mercedes GL or the Audi Q7.

True based on technical classification as a mid-size SUV. That said since the GC price sits squarely on top of the X3, I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that some people might be OK with cross-shopping the two. In practice, it's still a reasonably-sized two row SUV. The size difference feels negligible on American roads.

The GL and Q7 are truly larger vehicles. They can technically be had with three row seating.

[double_j]

Originally Posted by MichiganMike

Another point to consider, Consumer Reports rates the reliability of the Grand Cherokee as Poor at 67% worse than average. The same source rates the BMW X3 as Good at 8% above average for reliability.

That did cross my mind as I haven't had any experience with Chrysler products since the early 2000's. It should also be noted that the Jeep's warranty is 3/36 with roadside assist for 5/60. BMW provides a 4/50 warranty with roadside coverage for 4/unlimited and free maintenance.

One note - it looks like most of the complaints for the GC have been for the diesel engine. The gasoline engines seem mostly OK. The navigation system was also called out as a source of problem but couldn't find specifics.

[MichiganMike]

Originally Posted by double_j

One note - it looks like most of the complaints for the GC have been for the diesel engine. The gasoline engines seem mostly OK. The navigation system was also called out as a source of problem but couldn't find specifics.

Consumer Reports indicates with respect to the reliability of the Jeep GC:
In latest survey 2015 was rated good, but 2014 and 2013 models were rated overall as poor. This pattern typically indicates more problems arise after a year or two than is typical of most vehicles. Body integrity, power equipment and audio systems appear to be areas where problems are more likely to arise in the GC based on the CR data. YMMV.

[BeeMdblU]

1- I can close the trunk with the keyfob.
2-

[bailyhill]

Hello Double_j

Thanks for your in depth analysis and review. Since you are starting to appreciate comfort over sport, I thought I would suggest that you test drive the 2016 X3 Diesel. I just bought one, with 18 inch run flats, all the goodies. It gets 40 mpg with a light foot. Its peppy in both comfort and sport. It seems to have adequate power for me. It is available with tailgate closure via key fob, active cruise control. No remote start nor ventilated seats. I overheard that BMW will not put remote start on a car and it invalidates the warrantee if you do. They just don't want that liability, I guess.

I think w/o the sport suspension, and with the 18 inch rims, this car is completely different. I would be interested in your reaction to a test drive.

I really wanted a Macan Diesel, but they have not made that available and may never from what some dealers are saying. I have no regrets, and love the extra space.

Sin_Gas

[double_j]

Originally Posted by bailyhill

Hello Double_j

Thanks for your in depth analysis and review. Since you are starting to appreciate comfort over sport, I thought I would suggest that you test drive the 2016 X3 Diesel. I just bought one, with 18 inch run flats, all the goodies. It gets 40 mpg with a light foot. Its peppy in both comfort and sport. It seems to have adequate power for me. It is available with tailgate closure via key fob, active cruise control. No remote start nor ventilated seats. I overheard that BMW will not put remote start on a car and it invalidates the warrantee if you do. They just don't want that liability, I guess.

I think w/o the sport suspension, and with the 18 inch rims, this car is completely different. I would be interested in your reaction to a test drive.

I really wanted a Macan Diesel, but they have not made that available and may never from what some dealers are saying. I have no regrets, and love the extra space.

Sin_Gas

Thanks for the feedback. I'll check it out. After writing the analysis, I did question if it was the space that I like moreso than the actual driving dynamics. With that, I was also planning to see if I could test drive a lightly used X5 from my local BMW dealer. I'm not holding out any hope but if anybody should have an incentive to make my depreciation hit as small as possible, it'll be them.

[gc3]

My son works in the industry and supplies parts to BMW. The G01 starts production April 2017. Plan accordingly. Not sure when dealers start taking orders.

[SCOTT26]

The G01 will start official production in August 2017 after test production in April 2017 and will be on sale for the US market at the end of 2017 with European and other markets starting in the 1st quarter of 2018. G01 will also be manufactured outside Spartanburg at the multi-award winning Rosslyn plant in South Africa.
For the first time the X3 will be available with iPerformance PHEV and X3M.
European and select markets will be offered M Performance model.

[ChicagoNorthShore]

Originally Posted by gc3

My son works in the industry and supplies parts to BMW. The G01 starts production April 2017. Plan accordingly. Not sure when dealers start taking orders.

So if my lease ends December 2017, I should be fine to get the updated X3?

[MichiganMike]

Originally Posted by ChicagoNorthShore

So if my lease ends December 2017, I should be fine to get the updated X3?

All reports suggest the next generation X3 should be available in the US by the date your lease ends in December 2017.

Three points for you to consider:
1. Are you willing to accept the uncertain reliability of the 2018 X3 produced during the first few months of a new generation?
2. Are you willing to purchase or lease a 2018 X3 at a point in time when discounts may be minimal?
3. Are you prepared to order a 2018 build very early (possibly before any reviews are available) to assure delivery by December 2017 or to select from what may be a limited inventory at dealers?

[Smithy2014]

Some good points there. People who ordered the Land Rover Discovery Sport for delivery at launch were disappointed when LR later announced that a few months down the line the vehicle would have the new Ingenium engine, a much more efficient, powerful and quieter engine than the tractor TD4 engine that was fitted to the early cars. The resale value of those earlier cars would be a lot lower.

I have come to terms with the fact that I wont get the G01 when my lease expires next year, so looks like it will be the LC1 and hopefully on a 2 year deal rather than 3 (would even go for a 1 year deal but doubt BMW would offer that!) Could extend my current lease I suppose for another 12 months to take me to March 2018 but would rather have a new car - have horrible feeling that when the warranty runs out things will inevitably start to go wrong...