[cohenfive]

I'm in the process of hopefully buying a used 2011 X3 3.5i. The car I'm interested in needs new tires, and assuming that is factored into the price, I'm considering whether to get rft's to replace the oem pzero rft (probably bridgestone) or to go with a traditional tire. I'm wondering how many of you have switched over to traditional tires even with the added risk, or is everybody going with rft's and paying the extra money and getting what sounds like not quite as good performance...I'm torn, looking for anyone's views on the topic.

[Tjalle]

All car manufacturers test and approve some tires for their cars - obviously even all-seasons for the US. Those approved tires will be produced according to an agreed spec. I.e. if you buy "the same" tire from a non-OE shop, tires might differ from the approved. Very few people will notice.

I was, somewhat, disappointed with the handling with my (BMW approved) 20" Pirelli Pzeros, until I lowered my car.

[pokerface]

Pirelli PZero has been ranked relatively low in the performance tire segment.. Totally disappointed in them as while they're better in dry grip than my all season P7's, they are worse in the rain.

OP, I see in your sig that you have an E92 M3.. which ran on conventional tires without a spare. Your risk on the X3 will be the same, right?

I've seen a number of X3 and X5 running Continental DWS which I believe does not come in RFT. Take that for what it's worth..

[gIzzE]

The X3 on run flats is crap imho, on proper tyres it is very, very good.

The US is a bit behind the times regarding run flats, it is a bit like the UK 10 years ago when all cars came with them, now you can spec the car on proper tyres in most countries.

Mine came with Pirelli P7s (non rft) from the factory.
I just bought some 19" sport wheels which are on Pirelli run flats, they ruin the car, so I have ordered some more but this time non run flats. Why compromise and ruin a good car?

[brissim]

Plenty of threads on this subject in this forum and - I expect - every BMW forum around. We switched out the RFT for conventional tyres soon after picking up our car 4 years ago and have never regretted it. In our situation because of the general out-of-the-way places we go, we have the security of the a full size spare permanently tied down in the back. In 4 years and 80k km (50k miles) only had to use it once but was worth it. For us, still plenty of room in the back for luggage. At least here in Australia the conventional tyres cost considerably less and have higher mileage (most RFT available in the Australian market tend to be performance-biased tyres which have a higher wear rate).

Our solution is not for everyone but it does show it can be done.

Tony

[pokerface]

Brissm (Tony) - for the benefit of interested members could you show a pic of your set up in your trunk?

thanks

[ianfp]

My P Zero run flats are sitting in my shed with 9000 miles on them (must remember to sell them). I changed to non run flat Pirelli P Zero Rosso and they have a relatively hard compound rubber, but the car rides so much better. I bought the BMW emergency inflation kit and tucked it away in the boot!

[brissim]

Originally Posted by pokerface

Brissm (Tony) - for the benefit of interested members could you show a pic of your set up in your trunk?

thanks

I'll try to upload a picture when I get home later today.

Tony

[brissim]

Attached photo of full size spare in the back of our X3. The wooden cover is to give a flat surface to load luggage on. As said above, this solution is not for everyone. There's only the two of us now with the kids off our hands so on our trips there's still enough luggage room for the two of us. If we need to carry any loads we can borrow my brother-in-laws ute (pickup).

ps : the car's still a bit dirty - hasn't been washed from last weeks trip.

Measurements
: up to top of cover : 275mm (10.8ins) - its a 235mm width tyre.
: from top of cover to roof : 520mm (20.5ins)
So roughly the spare takes up around 35% of the available 550 litre volume of boot/trunk.

Tony

[brissim]

Meant to mention the tieing down of the tyre/tire. Australian-spec X3s come standard with the what I believe is called the extended storage package which includes the two lashing rails you see in the photo together with fastening points. I do recall that these item may be extra cost options in some markets.

I find it intriguing that the width of the two lashing rails just happens to be perfectly spaced for the OEM overall diameter of the F25's tyre/tire.

Tony

[Tjalle]

I still have a problem with how much you read into the tires, when you have your vehicles high up in the air , but....

"Chopper45" on the X4 forum - he lives in Ireland - bad roads - made an extensive research about best tires for X5, and found it to be: Vredestein Ultrac Vorti, 20" non-RFT.
He ditched his new 20" PZeros RFT:s and installed Vredesteins and claims he "got a new car": better comfort and handling performance.

[PX3]

Originally Posted by Tjalle

I still have a problem with how much you read into the tires, when you have your vehicles high up in the air , but....

"Chopper45" on the X4 forum - he lives in Ireland - bad roads - made an extensive research about best tires for X5, and found it to be: Vredestein Ultrac Vorti, 20" non-RFT.
He ditched his new 20" PZeros RFT:s and installed Vredesteins and claims he "got a new car": better comfort and handling performance.

Although according to Auto Express the tyre does have some flaws in the wet:

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/accesso...n-ultrac-vorti

Something we need to bear in mind here in the UK (and I'm sure in Ireland too)

[Tjalle]

Interesting. Final "say so"= OK are from German engineers to approve a tire for production. According to Autoexpress, PZeros:s are on 9:th place in this category.

I am convinced BMW would not put on bad tires, to save a dollar or two,(the RFT issue put aside), so we have a situation where I am happy (20" PZero, RFT, lowered vehicle), while others have found other tires - mostly non-RFT:s - that they prefer.

Normally, and I believe this also goes for the US, people will not push tires for handling on roads over about 50% of its capacity - braking and handling in wet is different.

I.e. to my mind: steering precision, steer-into-a-curve, and straight-ahead-stability are the main attributes for tires - together with handling and braking in wet.

[cohenfive]

I like the idea of a mobility kit instead of run flats. Yes I am 'running' that risk with my m3. Unfortunately, I made an offer on the X3 last night and the seller turned me down cold. Nice car, guess I'm still looking. Thanks for the advice gang. If/when I buy one, likely I will put conventional tires on it and get the mobility kit for it just in case...

[BruceOmega]

OP

When it came time to replace the OEM Goodyear LS2's on our X3, size 245/45-19, I wanted to stay with run flats for safety and convenience, especially since our X3 is primarily my wife's car.

Replaced the LS2's with Michelin Primacy MXM4 ZP (run flat) tires. We like them, have no issues. Ride quality is good, although we have DHP which may be a factor; handling and snow traction is fine, at least for an all season; they are quiet; and they hold air pressure very well.

FWIW, I believe that tire is also available in the same size but with a higher speed rating and is not a run flat.

I initially considered the Potenza 960 A/S RFTs, but decided against them because in the 19" size their load rating is lower than the OEM tires. I have no idea if that is an issue, just wanted to be on the safe side.

Bruce

[ianfp]

Originally Posted by cohenfive

I like the idea of a mobility kit instead of run flats. Yes I am 'running' that risk with my m3. Unfortunately, I made an offer on the X3 last night and the seller turned me down cold. Nice car, guess I'm still looking. Thanks for the advice gang. If/when I buy one, likely I will put conventional tires on it and get the mobility kit for it just in case...

I have the BMW mobility kit and it has quite a nice powerful compressor and also the tire gunk. So I am quite confident that it will get me out of trouble without too much fuss.

[PX3]

Whilst on the topic of changing / replacing tyres, are we expected to change all 4 tyres at the same time when the time comes? (whether you're replacing runflats for runflats or standard for standard)
Is it still recommended to replace all at once?

I have staggered tyres, in case it makes a difference.

Just thought this information would be beneficial for all.

Thanks

[Tjalle]

Yes, it is definitely recommended to change all, for various reasons.

If you have staggered tires there is little you (we) can do, but I propose to plan for "end of life": normally you should not change direction - it will - somewhat - reduce tire life.

For us using wintertires, we will anyhow reinstall all wheels every spring.

When you have 20-40% left of "life", you can check condition, and mount tires with excessive wear in rear - note you have to be cautious - "bad" tires in rear could be hazardous when braking - at least in wet condition. Although ABS and ESP would take care of most cases

[woodchuck1]

The other day I noticed that a compact spare is now optional on the X5. I hope that will be the case with the next X3.

[brissim]

Originally Posted by woodchuck1

The other day I noticed that a compact spare is now optional on the X5. I hope that will be the case with the next X3.

Not sure about the US market but a space saver spare has been standard equipment on Aussie-spec F15 X5s since the F15 was launched here 18 months or more ago. You only loose the space saver spare if you opt for the 3rd row seating option (gets replaced by a mobility kit).

Personally, I rate a space saver spare below that of run-flats. Just don't see the point of them. You have still got to stop and change the tyre and then you are subject to pretty much the same distance and speed restrictions you have with a punctured runflat tyre. And where do you put the punctured full size tyre?

For me, its either a full size spare or you may as well stay with the runflats.

Tony

[gIzzE]

Originally Posted by brissim

Not sure about the US market but a space saver spare has been standard equipment on Aussie-spec F15 X5s since the F15 was launched here 18 months or more ago. You only loose the space saver spare if you opt for the 3rd row seating option (gets replaced by a mobility kit).

Personally, I rate a space saver spare below that of run-flats. Just don't see the point of them. You have still got to stop and change the tyre and then you are subject to pretty much the same distance and speed restrictions you have with a punctured runflat tyre. And where do you put the punctured full size tyre?

For me, its either a full size spare or you may as well stay with the runflats.

Tony

Or get off the run flats as they are crashy, tramline more, wear the edges too quickly, don't grip as well on anything but pool table flat surfaces and puncture far easier, and use a compressor and gunk, which will also get you as far as a run flat in 99% of flats.

The difference between the X3 on run flats and proper tyres is not a subtle difference, it transforms the car in many areas, and why compromise when you have bought "The Ultimate Driving Machine"??

I know someone who did 3 laps of the 'Ring in his E92 M3 with gunk in his flat tyre, I wouldn't have the balls to do that, but shows how good the gunk and compressor kit is.

[TK - 421]

Originally Posted by gIzzE

Or get off the run flats as they are crashy, tramline more, wear the edges too quickly, don't grip as well on anything but pool table flat surfaces and puncture far easier, and use a compressor and gunk, which will also get you as far as a run flat in 99% of flats.

The difference between the X3 on run flats and proper tyres is not a subtle difference, it transforms the car in many areas, and why compromise when you have bought "The Ultimate Driving Machine"??

I know someone who did 3 laps of the 'Ring in his E92 M3 with gunk in his flat tyre, I wouldn't have the balls to do that, but shows how good the gunk and compressor kit is.

Agree with this.

What non RFT's would you recommend for UK roads Gizze?
Always been a fan of michy's interesting to know what the consensus is on here for the X3.