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Greetings,

I'm a 135i owner, and I love it. I have added some M3 suspension parts to it to make it even more fun to drive. Which admittedly is mostly to work... I've also got a 2 year old daughter, and drive a 2005 Saturn Vue on the days I need to take her somewhere, and also for the days it's snowy out (I live in MN) or we take a family road trip (Wife has an Outlander Sport, too small for the trips).

I'm definitely replacing the Saturn, it's been awesome but it's time. Candidates include the very pedestrian Rogue, Edge, Outback and others but I have a desire for another BMW assuming it'll be a lot more fun to drive, especially with the "upgraded" suspension. But at the same time, I don't want the passengers to hate it - i.e. bouncy, rough.

I'm looking for something in the 2015 vintage or so and thought this would be the best place to get some clarifications. Q1) I was originally thinking that the M-Sport package would include the tighter suspension (as it did for the 135i), but now I'm seeing that's actually a separate Dynamic Handling package and the M-Sport is more appearance modifications? I'm unsure which adds the handling package or if perhaps both are a factor. Q2) For those that have driven both, what did you think, is passenger comfort a concern (This question may be dependent on my understanding of the 1st one)?

If anyone's got a minute to help explain these, I'd appreciate it. Thanks!

[MichiganMike]

In the US for the F25 X3, M-Sport trim does not include a sport suspension. There is a dynamic handling option, as you noted, that provides more flexibility in adjusting handling and comfort. DHP is a relatively rare option and will limit selection of used X3 vehicles and may add to repair costs long term.

My wife and I have two 2016 X3, neither has DHP. One has 18" run-flat tires and the other 19" run-flat tires. The 18" tires have a slightly softer ride, but there is not much difference. I have no problem with passenger comfort in either of my X3s. Some owners have changed from run-flats to conventional tires and report this improved ride comfort.

[Aspen235]

It will handle better than the Vue and is very comfortable. It is not like a BMW car, the height makes it jiggly, you feel the height as the car rocks fore/aft, side to side. The steering is disconnected compared to an e90. The ride height is a trade off.
Try a 3GT, I liked it, but Mrs Aspen wanted taller.

[tracer bullet]

Originally Posted by MichiganMike

In the US for the F25 X3, M-Sport trim does not include a sport suspension. There is a dynamic handling option, as you noted, that provides more flexibility in adjusting handling and comfort. DHP is a relatively rare option and will limit selection of used X3 vehicles and may add to repair costs long term.

My wife and I have two 2016 X3, neither has DHP. One has 18" run-flat tires and the other 19" run-flat tires. The 18" tires have a slightly softer ride, but there is not much difference. I have no problem with passenger comfort in either of my X3s. Some owners have changed from run-flats to conventional tires and report this improved ride comfort.

Thanks! I'm generally good at searching and learning but was getting confused. I think I see now that it's US spec vs. other portions of the world that made it seem different than this.

I see now that you are indeed right - M Sport is basically appearance, other than some small changes due to wheel diameter and its effect on ride / handling. And that suspension settings option, DHP (also seems to be Dynamic Damper Control), does look rare in my used inventory searches. I suppose I should consider it a bonus if I can find it but not worry about it, as you said it would also add repair expenses. In my experience shocks are some of the first things on a used car to need to be replaced.

I'll keep the tires in mind,t he run flat thing was an issue for the 1-Series cars as well.

My searches got a lot more clear, thanks again.

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Originally Posted by Aspen235

It will handle better than the Vue and is very comfortable. It is not like a BMW car, the height makes it jiggly, you feel the height as the car rocks fore/aft, side to side. The steering is disconnected compared to an e90. The ride height is a trade off.
Try a 3GT, I liked it, but Mrs Aspen wanted taller.

I'm sure most anything from BMW will be better. But I've been surprised by the Vue, I didn't hate it at all, it's a 250hp engine in a car that's about 3500lbs and pretty quick even by current standards. Handling leaves a lot to be desired, but I'm guessing there's all sorts of reasons for that, the audience it was made for as well as the inherent nature of an SUV. Primarily want to replace it with something more fun, and being a BMW owner already, naturally I am looking that direction. I do want taller as well, that little extra can really make a difference around here (even the Saturn was surfing and making me nervous just a couple weeks ago in a heavy dumping we got). I think a wagon would be good if I lived somewhere warmer.

Thanks to you as well!

[Tjalle]

I was - slightly - unhappy with steering precision on my X4 (DDP and 20"). H&R put a smile om my face. Lowers 1 1/2". Can be bought directly from Germany from distributor. Slightly less chassis comfort, but normal tires will compensate.

[Bufalo]

I daily drive an E90 328 with factory sport suspension. My wife has a '17 X3 35i with the M-sport appearance pack and standard suspension. I also have an '07 X3 that has eibach springs and bilstein shocks (repair/maintenance). The '17 is the "worst" handler of them all, but I'd rather drive it nearly anywhere over the other two. The electric power steering is at fault for most of its "shortcomings," but it still rocks the Eff out on a curvy road. And it rocks on the highway, and on a commute, and to the grocery store, and really to anywhere. It's a fabulous car and I'd recommend it over any other used SUV to someone who is accustomed to small RWD BMW's.

[najnad]

Agreed to what others have said. The X3 does not handle like a coupe or sedan...but it does handle better than most other SUVs I have driven which is one of the big reasons I bought it! About the only ones that I test drove that handled better were the Cayenne and Macan...but for what I could afford, the Porsche's had more miles and less options than the X3 I ended up buying. And I came from a heavily modified M3 sedan. Sure, some days I miss how that handled, but most days I am very happy with how the X3 handles.

[marc x]

I just wanted to add that I owned a 2002 Santa Fe and I honestly feel like my 2012 x3 has copied a lot of things from that year Santa Fe. And the Santa Fe Handled very well for the class it is. Just as well as the x3.

[tracer bullet]

Originally Posted by marc x

I just wanted to add that I owned a 2002 Santa Fe and I honestly feel like my 2012 x3 has copied a lot of things from that year Santa Fe. And the Santa Fe Handled very well for the class it is. Just as well as the x3.

LOL thanks but that's only making it worse I'm cutting things off my list and the current Tucson is still on it.

Originally Posted by Bufalo

... it still rocks the Eff out on a curvy road. And it rocks on the highway, and on a commute, and to the grocery store, and really to anywhere.

Good to hear.

[Peter_R]

In the UK when we were able to order the F25 M Sport, we had to order (specify) M Sport Suspension delete to remove the Sport suspension. Many people with the 19" or 20" alloys changed over to NON Run Flat Tyres and this was an excellent compromise in road holding and grip.

In my view my current 3 litre Diesel engined with 19" alloys + Sport Suspension with NON Run Flat Tyres gives excellent handling for a heavy vehicle. It can really be thrown around on the back roads of Oxfordshire.

[02420X3]

In the US and Canada Sport Suspension isn’t available. Sport Suspension Delete is required for every F25 built for those markets. DHP is the only suspension-related option available.

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Is there an easy way to visually see if the X3 has this option? Kind of like looking for "Harmon Kardon" in small letters on the speaker grill shows its presence, or the "M" on the bottom of the steering wheel for that package. Maybe a dial or button on the dash or some other indicator?

I ask because I find that Craigslist ads, the used car sites i.e. Carmax, and frustratingly even BMW's own bmwusa site are so often wrong on their listings or missing things altogether. I've somewhat determined to not trust them and instead look for certain things in the pictures.

[MichiganMike]

Originally Posted by tracer bullet

Is there an easy way to visually see if the X3 has this option? Kind of like looking for "Harmon Kardon" in small letters on the speaker grill shows its presence, or the "M" on the bottom of the steering wheel for that package. Maybe a dial or button on the dash or some other indicator?

I am not aware of visual difference that you are likely to see in photos that confirms presence of the DHP option. If you have access to the VIN for the vehicle, you may use a VIN decoder to find out whether DHP or other options of interest were included in the build.

https://www.bmwvin.com

Look for option "223 Dynamic Damper Control" in the list of options generated from the VIN.

Below is a link to a 2015 X3 equipped with the dynamic handling package. You may use the VIN from this vehicle to view a list of options that may be of interest in your search.

https://www.bmwofalexandria.com/deta...2833&NewUsed=0

[Peter_R]

Originally Posted by 02420X3

In the US and Canada Sport Suspension isn’t available. Sport Suspension Delete is required for every F25 built for those markets. DHP is the only suspension-related option available.

Yes! Fully understand. That was the reason I posted about the UK version with the Sport Suspension.

[MichiganMike]

Tracer Bullet,

Here are a few more points to consider on the DHP option for a used X3.

DHP on a F25 X3 is a rare option. My best guess is less than 5% of the vehicles will have this option. I have reviewed listings for at least a couple hundred F25 X3 vehicles over the past three years and noted only 3 with the DHP option. DHP is not an option that most dealers would order for F25 X3 inventory as few buyers from inventory are willing to pay another $1000+ dollars for this option. When I purchased my X3, it was difficult to find a DHP equipped car to even test drive. My dealer in 2016 had about 50 X3 vehicles in inventory and not one had DHP.

Those X3 owners that ordered DHP may have insisted on other options that you may not want. For example, the X3 at BMW of Alexandria in my previous post has 20" wheels that will not provide the ride comfort you appear to desire and may be more prone to tire and wheel damage from potholes in Minnesota.

Also, some owners that custom order the X3 with DHP do so because they accelerate and brake harder than most owners. Accordingly, a used X3 with DHP may be prone to have more wear due to aggressive driving.

You are free to insist on a rare unicorn of a vehicle with DHP, but you should be prepared to travel some distance to find one and possibly compromise on colors and other options. Good Hunting.

[tracer bullet]

Originally Posted by MichiganMike

... I have reviewed listings for at least a couple hundred F25 X3 vehicles over the past three years and noted only 3 with the DHP option.

Thank you once again, this saves me a lot of work. I went through this kind of thing hunting for my 135i, it was so rare to find a manual I started to feel like I was going to have to give up on that. I did finally succeed but it was frustrating. Not sure how many hours I spent searching every week for about 6 straight months but it was a ton. I'm going with what you said here and will be happy to have it but will not make it seem like a requirement and will stop searching specifically for it.

My ride handling requirements are probably what tons of people face - I want the handling to be fun enough that I won't mind driving the car when I'm the only one in it, which will be quite often. But at the same time I want it to be compliant enough to not hear complaints from the rest of the family. Tough balance there and since I'm keeping the 135i I can make concessions towards the latter.

I think at this point I'm pretty safe simply not worrying about any handling packages or add-ons and instead swapping wheels and tires as needed, if needed at all, sometime later on. I could start thinking of what I want there (19 or 20, run-flat or no) but then again I'm getting back into the same trap of artificially limiting myself to select cars that might be difficult to find.

I know for sure I want the N55 engine (which alone cuts out about 80% of the used X3's for sale). Beyond that I'd like the HK stereo, would like the M Sport package, and would like the huge sunroof but none of these are requirements. Sounds at this point I'm really just hunting for a decent deal and then should shut up and go for it. I just need to finish the mental exercises that say I should ignore the Rogue, Edge, Santa Fe, and etc and focus on the X3. Something else I suppose a lot of us face

[MichiganMike]

Originally Posted by tracer bullet

I know for sure I want the N55 engine (which alone cuts out about 80% of the used X3's for sale). Beyond that I'd like the HK stereo, would like the M Sport package, and would like the huge sunroof but none of these are requirements. Sounds at this point I'm really just hunting for a decent deal and then should shut up and go for it. I just need to finish the mental exercises that say I should ignore the Rogue, Edge, Santa Fe, and etc and focus on the X3. Something else I suppose a lot of us face

Both my X3 are the 35i trim. I agree with you on the desirability of the N55 engine. Beginning in the 2016 model year, the X3 35i came standard with the HK stereo and like the 2015 X3 35i also includes the panoramic sunroof, xenon headlights and LED taillights.

A few thoughts comparing the vehicles you have been considering:

2015 BMW X3 35i: 0 to 60 mph in under 6 seconds, 8 speed automatic transmission and near best in class handling;
Consumer Reports stated:
"The X3 is among the few SUV that can be driven spiritedly. It's agile, taut and feels confident in the corners. Body lean is well tied down. The steering is quick to respond and provides welcome feedback from the road surface. Further, the AWD system is transparent."

Rogue (2.5 L): 0 to 60 mph in 9.5 seconds, CV transmission and mediocre handling. In my opinion this is transportation and not a driver's car.

Santa Fe (V6): 0 to 60 mph in 7.6 seconds, 6 speed automatic transmission, handling is middle of the pack, offers more cargo space and is 7 inches longer than the X3. In my opinion, this is more a passenger/cargo hauler than a sporty SUV.

Edge (2.7 L V6): 0 to 60 mph in under 6 seconds (2L turbo and 3.5L normally aspirated engine options are slower and less refined), 6 speed transmission. The 2.7L Edge is a couple hundred pounds heavier and several inches longer than the same model year X3 and it drives like it.

[Lurcher]

Originally Posted by tracer bullet

Beyond that I'd like the HK stereo,

The HiFi stereo is easier to upgrade (amp/speakers), and can quite easily be made to sound better.

Don't let that be the deal breaker for you....

[tracer bullet]

I agree on the Rogue, I've knocked it off the list. I compare it to driving a toaster to work, without the unique feature of actually being able to cook toast on the way. Definite point A to B car, a good rental. I misspoke on the Santa Fe, I meant Tuscon. Seems that the size is comparable and while not a fun car better than the Rogue. Cost would be a lot lower as well. Edge would have to be bought w/ the Sport version, drastically reducing choices available again and upping the price. When you start going there you're not saving much which would be the point. The Mercedes, Volvo, etc. options get knocked out because if I go the Euro route I'm just getting the Bimmer. I've got a few others on the list, spreadsheet actually, but it's not with me at the moment. The Acura RDX and some others are on it but the nicer stuff will get crossed off in favor of the Bimmer ,and the more common stuff will take the same route as the Rogue I am sure. I know this in my heart already but I still need to do that mental justification work.

Anyhow - Thanks guys for all the help and info, I mostly was looking at handling packages at first but this has all been great, especially learning about the things that got included each year (i.e. the moonroof, headlight type). When you are on a forum and own a car you tend to learn it all and it all makes sense, but when you step in from the outside it's a lot to process and even diligent searching can be confusing.

Regarding the stereo, it looks like the Hi-Fi includes under-seat subs? I am guessing it's the same system then that the 1-Series came with. In that case an audio upgrade should indeed be easy. For the 1-ers you needed the HK system to get those subs, they could be retrofitted, but at great pain. I didn't spec it in mind but am glad I have it, I got a sub and amp for the trunk from MusicarNW and it really finished things off. If the X3 Hi-Fi includes those 8"s under the seat already then it's an easy upgrade this summer - hopefully they are 8" or at least can easily become that.

We'll get our bonuses at work in a few weeks and then it's off to do some shopping. I'm sure it'll be an X3, there's nothing else I've found yet to put in front of it. Thanks again!

[MichiganMike]

Tracer Bullet,

You mentioned headlight type among the things you learned. Having grown up in Minnesota, I am well aware of the winter months when you may need headlights going to work as well as returning home.

It is worth emphasizing that if good headlights are important to you, cross any X3 with halogen headlights off your list. If you get a X3 35i it likely will have xenon headlights and may have LED headlights. However, if you consider a X3 28i, check that it does not have halogen headlights.

IIHS.org provides some useful comparisons of headlights. Note for example that in the tests of the 2018 Ford Edge both the halogen headlights and upgraded HID headlights rated poor in the IIHS tests. Poor headlight performance is enough for me to cross a vehicle off my list of candidates.

http://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings/veh...-door-suv/2018

The headlights of the 2017 BMW X3 in the IIHS tests were rated marginal for both xenon (HID) and LED types and poor for halogens. Note the main reason for marginal rating of BMW xenon and LED headlights appears to be the sharp cutoff to the left of the vehicle to minimize the potential of blinding on-coming drivers. In my view this is not a bad thing.

http://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings/veh...-door-suv/2017

[tracer bullet]

I'm pretty much down to just the X3. My next hurdle is do I keep the 135i or trade it in. It's paid for and I have the garage space, but I don't drive it often (something like 22,000 miles in 6 years, 3 of those years were before I got married or had a baby). I'm seeing that in the future it may be even less often as the toddler becomes a full fledged kid, and I bike to work a little more often to help keep in shape. At this point it's what I'm wrestling with and have to figure out.

Either way though, I have however found 2 X3'sin the Minneapolis area of great interest and have contacted a dealership about one of them. All of the help here saved me a lot of confusion and helped convince me that the X3 which I really wanted was actually the "best" choice