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      03-02-2011, 04:52 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by sfax View Post
Woooooah. Green to red. What is this sorcery?!
If you think this is cool, you should see what it does when you activate the Chameleon Circuit. It's only available with the Time Lord Package though.
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      03-02-2011, 08:50 PM   #24
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Red-Green is as you suggested -- on target or off due to braking or acceleration. White-Red is the kinda the whole thing. Dials, needles, time, mpg, etc. It made so much sense that I didn't notice at first that they're white for daytime and red for night. The mpg graph changes, too.
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      03-02-2011, 08:53 PM   #25
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Ma78, that last sounded very "Portland" . . . not criticizing, just noting . . . I might be missing the West somethin' fierce . . .
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      03-02-2011, 09:17 PM   #26
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Ma78, that last sounded very "Portland" . . . not criticizing, just noting . . . I might be missing the West somethin' fierce . . .
I haven't gone native yet. Only been here two years! It was actually a Doctor Who reference.
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      03-03-2011, 02:10 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Ant Man View Post
sfax,
is the current gear displayed on the dash? You say you the engine has so far been responsive with the 8 speed auto. I'm pleased, this sounds far better than the manual 6sp. Could you try slowing down (off throttle without braking) from say 30 / 40 mph to say 5/10mph and then floor the accelerator and report back? And also do the same but use the brakes instead? If you are able to see what gears the gearbox selects and when would also be very interesting. I'd like to know if you do experience any delay in the car building speed.
Will get back to you on this. You only see the selected gear in the dash when in semi-automatic mode. Not tried this much yet.

Initial thoughts on pick up are it's much better than the Q5 which seemed to hesitate a lot more when you put your thought down
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      03-03-2011, 02:12 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by Nahoa View Post
Red-Green is as you suggested -- on target or off due to braking or acceleration. White-Red is the kinda the whole thing. Dials, needles, time, mpg, etc. It made so much sense that I didn't notice at first that they're white for daytime and red for night. The mpg graph changes, too.
Ah yes, understand the white red now. I had the same experience initially as all test drives were during the day. I thought you had some kind of white light at night thing going on!
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      03-03-2011, 03:18 PM   #29
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[QUOTE=sfax;9030818]Thanks, some caveats on my comments:



Steering. A lot of you guys have lots of BMW experience and experience with larger cars. I don't have any BMW experience and I've only owned VW Golfs up until now. I expect the steering to feel different on a much heavier and bigger car than my 3-door GTI. It is different but I like it. I think if I had a 28i or a 35i I would opt for VDC but I just don't think it's necessary in a 20d. I don't intend to drive the car like a sports car so I don't need it to feel like one. If you test drive an X3 with no VDC or VSS and you don't like the steering then go for VSS or VDC if you have the budget. For me, I'm glad I didn't.

Hard to understand your requirement for dynamic pack if your shying away from 'sport' then. And 19's - aren't you getting the opposite to what you want dynamically? Not sure how much faster you'd be travelling on the public highway with a 35i, the 20d seems plenty quick enough?
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      03-03-2011, 03:40 PM   #30
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[QUOTE=Dobs;9046994]
Quote:
Originally Posted by sfax View Post
Thanks, some caveats on my comments:



Steering. A lot of you guys have lots of BMW experience and experience with larger cars. I don't have any BMW experience and I've only owned VW Golfs up until now. I expect the steering to feel different on a much heavier and bigger car than my 3-door GTI. It is different but I like it. I think if I had a 28i or a 35i I would opt for VDC but I just don't think it's necessary in a 20d. I don't intend to drive the car like a sports car so I don't need it to feel like one. If you test drive an X3 with no VDC or VSS and you don't like the steering then go for VSS or VDC if you have the budget. For me, I'm glad I didn't.

Hard to understand your requirement for dynamic pack if your shying away from 'sport' then. And 19's - aren't you getting the opposite to what you want dynamically? Not sure how much faster you'd be travelling on the public highway with a 35i, the 20d seems plenty quick enough?
You couldn't spec the car with a sports steering wheel without adding the dynamic pack when I ordered. I didn't specifically want sports suspension but I did want sports seats, a sports steering wheel and 19" alloys, the last two for aesthetic reasons.

I'm not shying away from sport as you put it. I'm just saying that things like tightening up the steering with VSS and changing the gear ratios with VDC are not important to me on this car and I would only consider these options on a more powerful car. Not to mention adding another £1,100 a spec that was already over £43k.
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      03-06-2011, 04:11 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ant Man View Post
sfax,
is the current gear displayed on the dash? You say you the engine has so far been responsive with the 8 speed auto. I'm pleased, this sounds far better than the manual 6sp. Could you try slowing down (off throttle without braking) from say 30 / 40 mph to say 5/10mph and then floor the accelerator and report back? And also do the same but use the brakes instead? If you are able to see what gears the gearbox selects and when would also be very interesting. I'd like to know if you do experience any delay in the car building speed.
Tried some deliberate gradual braking and then flooring the accelerator today and there is a small delay before it kicks in. At least one second, probably more although I wasn't timing accurately and when it does kick in, it's fast, so I was having to be a bit careful not to take anyone out!

It's noticeable and if I was in my old car and I had selected 2nd gear and then floored the accelerator it would be quicker to react. I didn't manage to slow down from 40 to 10 without braking (not so easy in an automatic and with other cars on the road ) so this test was artificial but I'll have another look at it.

I don't think there is any cause for concern though.

I have also had some more time to play around with the steering and I am still 100% happy with it. I can feel the road through the tyres and taking roundabouts quickly (for example) feels natural and I get the feedback that I need. This may be due to my particular combination of servotronic steering, sports suspension and 19" alloys. Other combinations may vary.
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      03-06-2011, 04:16 PM   #32
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Oh, and I washed it today for the first time. A few things:

1. The alloys were filthy already - something to do with extra residue from the brakes when new perhaps?

2. The 19" double spokes are a little tricky to clean but I have no regrets because they look great

3. I'm 6'3" and can only just reach the middle of the top of the car when cleaning. If you're much shorter, you'll need a foot stool!
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      03-06-2011, 04:56 PM   #33
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Good to hear about the steering. This maybe more than anything else could be a deal breaker for my wife and I - have test-driven SUVs with zero feedback and hated it.
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      03-06-2011, 07:18 PM   #34
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Ha!

Had the same experiences, sfax.

1. The alloys; well, my experience with BMWs suggests that they tend to gunk up pretty fast. I'm always on the look out for something that keeps it from sticking as easily (Zaino is my current best friend). The performance of the brakes keeps me from whining too much.

2. The 309 "center gap" is gonna be rough to clean once the surface starts letting junk adhere more easily. Hoping the narrow angle will reduce the impact of that space being more dirty.

3. I had to use the step stool!! 5'-10". Damn genes.

Re gears and lag. Could you really downshift your old car and get on the throttle faster than the delay of the auto doing the equivalent? From decision to act, to clutch (or manual syncro if you're on that), to gear shift, to clutch lift, to throttle application? Sometimes I think we tend to compare the last two bits and forget the rest. No?
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      03-07-2011, 03:37 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nahoa View Post
1. The alloys; well, my experience with BMWs suggests that they tend to gunk up pretty fast. I'm always on the look out for something that keeps it from sticking as easily (Zaino is my current best friend). The performance of the brakes keeps me from whining too much.
Let me know if you find something!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nahoa View Post
2. The 309 "center gap" is gonna be rough to clean once the surface starts letting junk adhere more easily. Hoping the narrow angle will reduce the impact of that space being more dirty.
Yup, I might buy something that makes it easier to get at these bits

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Originally Posted by Nahoa View Post
3. I had to use the step stool!! 5'-10". Damn genes.
- I'm glad I didn't buy an X5 or I would need one too!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nahoa View Post
Re gears and lag. Could you really downshift your old car and get on the throttle faster than the delay of the auto doing the equivalent? From decision to act, to clutch (or manual syncro if you're on that), to gear shift, to clutch lift, to throttle application? Sometimes I think we tend to compare the last two bits and forget the rest. No?
This is a valid point but if I slowed down through the gears on my old 2.0T petrol manual, I would already be in 2nd and ready to floor it. At this point the old car outperforms the auto because it was instantaneous - it depends where you start the clock if that makes sense. Yes, the old car requires more work changing down beforehand.

It's really not a problem for me but I wanted to answer the question that Ant Man had posed.
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      03-08-2011, 11:58 AM   #36
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To further complicate things on the steering comments, refer to jijioben's post here and specifically the chart and his comments. I'm not sure where a UK spec car with the dynamic package and servotronic fits into this chart but it could mean I have tighter steering at speed than you get with no servo + dyn.

http://x3.xbimmers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=497483

All I can say is that personally I have no problems at all with the steering feel and I'm pleased I didn't go for VDC or VSS.
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      03-08-2011, 02:48 PM   #37
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Understand you point about VDC stax as you are happy with the ride but not your VSS point (which I have ordered). Why would you not want VSS, especially when parking or on motorway? Saves £380 I guess (or £200 if you keep the servotronic).
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      03-08-2011, 03:01 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X3buyerScotland View Post
Understand you point about VDC stax as you are happy with the ride but not your VSS point (which I have ordered). Why would you not want VSS, especially when parking or on motorway? Saves £380 I guess (or £200 if you keep the servotronic).
My rationale is that servotronic on its own does enough for me and if I had VSS I wouldn't use it much, or perhaps I would always have to set it to Sport when I got in.

Re. parking this is covered by servotronic. Easier to turn the wheel at low speeds to park. Re. motorway, not sure, just seems natural and I like it. At least with VSS you have the option to change the feel whereas with just servotronic you get what you're given - but I like what I've been given so far.

Also VSS includes servotronic so it has all of this and more - I think! Question is does VSS Normal mode = Servo + Dynamic package or does VSS Sport mode = servo + dyn. I have no idea I'm afraid.
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      03-08-2011, 03:34 PM   #39
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Thanks. I just assumed VSS was servotronic with bells on and as you say, provides an alternative option. For now I guess I leave it in my spec until someone who has it can update. Shout if you see that buddy.
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      03-08-2011, 03:58 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfax View Post
Tried some deliberate gradual braking and then flooring the accelerator today and there is a small delay before it kicks in. At least one second, probably more although I wasn't timing accurately and when it does kick in, it's fast, so I was having to be a bit careful not to take anyone out!

It's noticeable and if I was in my old car and I had selected 2nd gear and then floored the accelerator it would be quicker to react. I didn't manage to slow down from 40 to 10 without braking (not so easy in an automatic and with other cars on the road ) so this test was artificial but I'll have another look at it.

I don't think there is any cause for concern though.

I have also had some more time to play around with the steering and I am still 100% happy with it. I can feel the road through the tyres and taking roundabouts quickly (for example) feels natural and I get the feedback that I need. This may be due to my particular combination of servotronic steering, sports suspension and 19" alloys. Other combinations may vary.
Thanks for posting this. Did you feel the g/box kick down to 1st at all? Is there only one shift speed setting on the auto or is there a sport mode? 1 second is a very long time if you consider pulling onto a roundabout or into a gap of traffic where you are effectively a sitting duck during this time. Have you learnt to drive around this so it's less noticable? When I had the 320d for a few weeks I hadn't driven a turbo diesel before (driven plenty of small engine petrols) and was shocked at the lag waiting for the turbo to spool up at low revs in the above scenario, as I posted before Despite the small petrol cars having much less power and torque, they had much better drive at very low revs. The test you performed exagerated the turbo lag so when the car is slowing down and revs drop, the pressure drops and the turbo takes time to respool to drive the car forward.

I'm glad you can feel the road through the steering as it sounds like you have opted for the best and most natural steering set up. I've noted this for my future purchase.
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      03-08-2011, 04:04 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X3buyerScotland View Post
Understand you point about VDC stax as you are happy with the ride but not your VSS point (which I have ordered). Why would you not want VSS, especially when parking or on motorway? Saves £380 I guess (or £200 if you keep the servotronic).
I have read two reviews of VSS in UK mags and neither reviewer liked it. Both nearly had the car off the road due to the car steering more than they anticpated, i.e. variable. One might though get used to it.
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      03-08-2011, 04:06 PM   #42
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Any half decent wax and paint sealant will reduce the amount of brake dust sticking to the alloys and make it easier to wash off.
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      03-08-2011, 04:13 PM   #43
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That doesnt sound good Ant. Do you remember which mags? I guess the response might vary with what other options are fitted. On my Merc, the VSS is pin perfect for aiming the car regardless of speed. It almost feels as if it knows where you want it to go with mm accuracy. That is why I hoped for a speed plus super lazy parking at the slow.
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      03-08-2011, 04:17 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X3buyerScotland View Post
That doesnt sound good Ant. Do you remember which mags? I guess the response might vary with what other options are fitted. On my Merc, the VSS is pin perfect for aiming the car regardless of speed. It almost feels as if it knows where you want it to go with mm accuracy. That is why I hoped for a speed plus super lazy parking at the slow.
BMW Car Mag - I've got the edition - X3 is on the front cover. I can't recall the other one right now. I read too many
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