[Ranger 6]

Well mine is better than the other two X3s I've had - 33.8mpg average (spreadsheet)

[Portimao318]

I find it very amusing how grown men first have no problem paying 50.000 or more for a car , and than make it a big issue if the fuel consumption is 33 or 38 mpg...

[gIzzE]

Originally Posted by Endre2

I find it very amusing how grown men first have no problem paying 50.000 or more for a car , and than make it a big issue if the fuel consumption is 33 or 38 mpg...

It's is bizarre.

I simply don't get it either, but seems to be the most discussed topic on many forums.

[buze]

I don't see how this could be considered bizarre, it's just another stat, and we sign up to a forum related to our car because we're slightly (or more) anal about that sort of things. "bhp" and "mph" and "mpg" and the color of the fog lights, etc etc

Most normal people buy a car, drive it, sell it. They don't sign up here, so, whats the surprise about ? ;-)

[Peter_R]

Originally Posted by buze

I don't see how this could be considered bizarre, it's just another stat, and we sign up to a forum related to our car because we're slightly (or more) anal about that sort of things. "bhp" and "mph" and "mpg" and the color of the fog lights, etc etc

Most normal people buy a car, drive it, sell it. They don't sign up here, so, whats the surprise about ? ;-)

There is a whole lot of truth in that statement. Some come on here to boast about how many BMWs they have owned and how good they are. Many come on to ask a question before they go to dealer so they are well informed.

[gIzzE]

Originally Posted by buze

I don't see how this could be considered bizarre, it's just another stat, and we sign up to a forum related to our car because we're slightly (or more) anal about that sort of things. "bhp" and "mph" and "mpg" and the color of the fog lights, etc etc

Most normal people buy a car, drive it, sell it. They don't sign up here, so, whats the surprise about ? ;-)

I don't think that was aimed at you mate, just a comment on how once again we are talking MPG.

The 'bizarre' thing is we are all so fixated with MPG, the difference for many is maybe £10 or £15 a week between a car doing 30 and one doing 40mpg, when you then consider many will loose maybe £500 a month in depreciation, spend £100 on servicing, tyres, insurance and we of course have to fill up whether it is 30 or 40 mpg so still spend another £150 on fuel at least, then why do we really worry about?

I include myself in that btw.

I know people who have sold a car they loved to drive because seeing sub 30mpg on the OBC ruined their ownership experience. But really we should do some proper maths and realise in the grand scheme of things we should just say "Sod it! Let's just enjoy it!"

[Portimao318]

I just made a general remark. It's like glzzE explained.

I do think it hilarious (and bizarre) that when somebody can afford to buy an expensive car, he bothers so much about the fuel consumption. If you have the money for a BMW, you also should have the money to drive it, no matter if 30 or 40 mpg.

But BMW is making 3 cilinders now, so we can save another 10 pounds a week on fuel!!

[Peter_R]

Originally Posted by Endre2

I find it very amusing how grown men first have no problem paying 50.000 or more for a car , and than make it a big issue if the fuel consumption is 33 or 38 mpg...

So do I. In my view, it has little to do with the actual fuel consumption though. It is all down to the usual young male willie waving syndrome of "mine is better or bigger than yours!"

[gIzzE]

How is it 'willy waving' when people are taking the Mickey out of themselves?

I have said on numerous occasions despite doing all the maths I go and buy the diesel because I am scared to stray from the done thing. We all do it in the UK. BMW don't even offer a petrol in the UK on the X3 as they know 99% of people will buy a diesel.

It is the first time I have replied to one of you posts in weeks as I dread the avalanche of abuse, so please try and be polite if you do reply.

[Peter_R]

Originally Posted by gIzzE

How is it 'willy waving' when people are taking the Mickey out of themselves?

That is your view...How can one decide whether the comment is "taking the mickey out of themselves" or posting seriously? Many post factually and take it seriously.

Originally Posted by gIzzE

I have said on numerous occasions despite doing all the maths I go and buy the diesel because I am scared to stray from the done thing. We all do it in the UK. BMW don't even offer a petrol in the UK on the X3 as they know 99% of people will buy a diesel.

Firstly who says we all do it in the UK? If you follow the herd instinct then that is up to you. Why do you worry about what others think? I have been driving diesels since approximately 1995 (Golf Tdi) because I like the low down torque and laziness of said technology. I used to run Golf GTi's for the previous 14 years and many other petrol marques back to 1960 and thoroughly enjoyed them. Although brash and noisy to Scotland and back,they [Golf GTi's] suited my needs at the time, but as diesels improved I started to drive them because of the lazy way you can operate them. We all have different reasons for going in the direction we do. All cars are money pits, no matter how you do the maths.

Originally Posted by gIzzE

It is the first time I have replied to one of you posts in weeks as I dread the avalanche of abuse, so please try and be polite if you do reply.

I would suggest you have an inferiority complex problem when it comes to reading my posts, I am getting the impression that you think I am having a go at you in particular. Well for the record I am not, I am posting in general. To avoid any misunderstanding in this thread, I have started to use icons such as to make it more friendly. What avalanche of abuse? I answer as I feel fit and not impolitely after our previous discussions.

If some people post remarks and I feel they are contentious and I disagree, then I will make comments to the contrary giving my reasons. I post a comment and you do not agree, then you post back saying in your view that is incorrect. That is what forums are all about.

Now back to my original statement, there IS a lot of "Willie waving" going on in lots of threads on car forums. Some of the remarks are outrageous and if have experience in that particular subject, and if I think they are contentious, then I might make comments to the contrary, there again I may not. One particular area of experience I have is fuels and oils and the testing thereof because, I was a policy maker and head of a testing laboratory in Woolwich some years ago.

Finally I am sorry this is a long post, but before I retired from a very large organisation, I was head of 200 engineering guys and when we had meetings with everyone present, it was easy to see who was joking and who was serious, by how they physically presented themselves to others. This principle cannot be applied on forums because the wording sometimes comes across as offensive when it is far from that. Emotive icons can help sometimes, but sometimes they can make matters worse.

Regards

[Smithy2014]

so back to the Discovery Sport question...................

[Peter_R]

Originally Posted by Smithy2014

so back to the Discovery Sport question...................

Yep...said that a long time back........

Originally Posted by Peter_R

Anyway, this thread is all about the Discovery Sport. End of discussion.

[gIzzE]

Originally Posted by Peter_R

That is your view...How can one decide whether the comment is "taking the mickey out of themselves" or posting seriously? Many post factually and take it seriously.

Because if someone ends a mickey take with "I include myself in that btw. " you know they are talking about themselves.

Originally Posted by Peter_R

Firstly who says we all do it in the UK? If you follow the herd instinct then that is up to you. Why do you worry about what others think? I have been driving diesels since approximately 1995 (Golf Tdi) because I like the low down torque and laziness of said technology. I used to run Golf GTi's for the previous 14 years and many other petrol marques back to 1960 and thoroughly enjoyed them. Although brash and noisy to Scotland and back,they [Golf GTi's] suited my needs at the time, but as diesels improved I started to drive them because of the lazy way you can operate them. We all have different reasons for going in the direction we do. All cars are money pits, no matter how you do the maths.

I agree, however now most new cars are force induced and behave just like diesels, just smoother and more refined. Comparing a 28i with a 20d is very different to comparing a 1.9tdi with a 1.8i from 20 years ago.

Originally Posted by Peter_R

I would suggest you have an inferiority complex problem when it comes to reading my posts, I am getting the impression that you think I am having a go at you in particular. Well for the record I am not, I am posting in general.

To avoid any misunderstanding in this thread, I have started to use icons such as to make it more friendly. What avalanche of abuse? I answer as I feel fit and not impolitely after our previous discussions.

No inferiority complex, I have had numerous PMs from others on here about your attitude, so I know it is not us.
Your 'avalanche of abuse' is the way you have to dissect everything anyone says, and then tell them they are wrong, or they are willy wavers etc. It gets tiring.
But, if you are genuine in what you say about trying to make your replies more friendly and you have tried to be more polite that is great.

Originally Posted by Peter_R

If some people post remarks and I feel they are contentious and I disagree, then I will make comments to the contrary giving my reasons. I post a comment and you do not agree, then you post back saying in your view that is incorrect. That is what forums are all about.

Totally agree.

Originally Posted by Peter_R

Now back to my original statement, there IS a lot of "Willie waving" going on in lots of threads on car forums. Some of the remarks are outrageous and if have experience in that particular subject, and if I think they are contentious, then I might make comments to the contrary, there again I may not. One particular area of experience I have is fuels and oils and the testing thereof because, I was a policy maker and head of a testing laboratory in Woolwich some years ago.

I don't think there is at all, I see it more that some people have very insular views and hate being told 'there may be another way' and get all defensive about their choice.

Originally Posted by Peter_R

Finally I am sorry this is a long post, but before I retired from a very large organisation, I was head of 200 engineering guys and when we had meetings with everyone present, it was easy to see who was joking and who was serious, by how they physically presented themselves to others. This principle cannot be applied on forums because the wording sometimes comes across as offensive when it is far from that. Emotive icons can help sometimes, but sometimes they can make matters worse.

In charge of 200 engineering guys? You willy waver you!!

[gIzzE]

Originally Posted by Smithy2014

so back to the Discovery Sport question...................

I'm going to take the Si4 out for a test I think, Harry Metcalfe said that is definitely the one to have, and if Harry says that is good enough for me.

[gIzzE]

Friend has the new Disco Sport, he just came back from France and said the Sat Nav was absolutely useless. Took him off the autoroute and down almost a single track which added over 2 hours, to his already 10 hour journey, before he realised what it was doing.
Then while in France he kept testing the nav out and the routes it was taking were bordering on absurd. He said you could see it was a 15km and 20minute journey looking at his iPhone maps, but the Disco Nav was saying 35km and 1 hour.


He said the forums are full of people saying the same thing.

They need to seriously sort that out.

[Peter_R]

Originally Posted by gIzzE

No inferiority complex, I have had numerous PMs from others on here about your attitude,

You have made my point!

[plymjack]

Originally Posted by Endre2

I just made a general remark. It's like glzzE explained.

I do think it hilarious (and bizarre) that when somebody can afford to buy an expensive car, he bothers so much about the fuel consumption. If you have the money for a BMW, you also should have the money to drive it, no matter if 30 or 40 mpg.

But BMW is making 3 cilinders now, so we can save another 10 pounds a week on fuel!!

Being one of those who is obsessed/impressed by the mpg of my X3 all I can say is that 10 years ago all 4x4s were the subject of media hate due to there poor performance and non "green" credentials. This is no longer the case as most are now much more efficient - so I get a great driving experience without the added cost of poor mpg.

The difference between 30&40mpg over 10k miles is around £450 - given that and the cheaper road tax all adds up.

[gIzzE]

Originally Posted by plymjack

Being one of those who is obsessed/impressed by the mpg of my X3 all I can say is that 10 years ago all 4x4s were the subject of media hate due to there poor performance and non "green" credentials. This is no longer the case as most are now much more efficient - so I get a great driving experience without the added cost of poor mpg.

Absolutely, my ML270cdi would often finish the tankful on 22mpg, so to get 40+ no matter what and close to 50 sometimes is a real bonus.

Originally Posted by plymjack

The difference between 30&40mpg over 10k miles is around £450 - given that and the cheaper road tax all adds up.

Or £8.60 a week.

And that is my point regarding mpg when looking at a newish car, it is such a small percentage of overall ownership costs that the the only real reason for me to do it is to self justify buying a new car.... "Oh, if I swap my old car that only does 30mpg for this new one it will do 40+ and I will save a fortune."

Nothing wrong with that, it is basic man maths, but let's not try and convince ourselves it is any real saving.

My ML I just sold for £3k. It did 28mpg average over the 2 years and 40,000 miles I owned it.
My X3 was around the £30k mark used and will sell for around £15k after 4 years and 80k miles.
That £10 a week I am saving on fuel is not much compared to the £72 a week it will loose over the next 4 years, and that is if I keep it 4 years, any less and the depreciation is far more damaging.

I got a few quotes against a Range Rover recently, I was offered £22k from 3 different dealers for my 2013 X3, that is £266 a week depreciation. Sort of puts a £10 a week fuel saving into perspective.



But at the same time it is great, I did 628 miles on Sunday and Monday before filling up, the fact it took just £70 at the pump too was even better!

As I said before, I still fall for it myself, I use it as a justification to buy a new toy, but the reality is, the difference isn't anywhere near as big as we think financially.

[ianfp]

Originally Posted by gIzzE

Absolutely, my ML270cdi would often finish the tankful on 22mpg, so to get 40+ no matter what and close to 50 sometimes is a real bonus.





Or £8.60 a week.

And that is my point regarding mpg when looking at a newish car, it is such a small percentage of overall ownership costs that the the only real reason for me to do it is to self justify buying a new car.... "Oh, if I swap my old car that only does 30mpg for this new one it will do 40+ and I will save a fortune."

Nothing wrong with that, it is basic man maths, but let's not try and convince ourselves it is any real saving.

My ML I just sold for £3k. It did 28mpg average over the 2 years and 40,000 miles I owned it.
My X3 was around the £30k mark used and will sell for around £15k after 4 years and 80k miles.
That £10 a week I am saving on fuel is not much compared to the £72 a week it will loose over the next 4 years, and that is if I keep it 4 years, any less and the depreciation is far more damaging.

I got a few quotes against a Range Rover recently, I was offered £22k from 3 different dealers for my 2013 X3, that is £266 a week depreciation. Sort of puts a £10 a week fuel saving into perspective.



But at the same time it is great, I did 628 miles on Sunday and Monday before filling up, the fact it took just £70 at the pump too was even better!

As I said before, I still fall for it myself, I use it as a justification to buy a new toy, but the reality is, the difference isn't anywhere near as big as we think financially.

Going from my 3 Litre petrol to my diesel X3, I have halved my fuel bill, insurance and road tax. I also hope that the depreciation on my more economical car will be less than my 3.0 M sport.

You are absolutely right though - any savings on running costs are far outweighed by the cost of the car and the depreciation that it will inevitably see.

[gIzzE]

Originally Posted by ianfp

Going from my 3 Litre petrol to my diesel X3, I have halved my fuel bill, insurance and road tax. I also hope that the depreciation on my more economical car will be less than my 3.0 M sport.

You are absolutely right though - any savings on running costs are far outweighed by the cost of the car and the depreciation that it will inevitably see.

Again, this is how we all compare it, I look at my old petrols, 528i, 530i, 330i, M3, S4 and jump into a 'modern' diesel like the X3 and see it doing almost twice as much. However, I think someone who had been driving a 2008 330i with the direct injection engine who went into the 2008 335 would have a bit of a shock.
There would be around 4-5mpg difference at best with the diesel, not what you would expect.

[Portimao318]

Originally Posted by ianfp

Going from my 3 Litre petrol to my diesel X3, I have halved my fuel bill, insurance and road tax. I also hope that the depreciation on my more economical car will be less than my 3.0 M sport.

You are absolutely right though - any savings on running costs are far outweighed by the cost of the car and the depreciation that it will inevitably see.

So , in UK a Diesel car is CHEAPER in road tax and insurance than a petrol car ???
In the Netherlands it's just the other way round. Road tax for a Diesel car is double of that for a petrol car.

[Peter_R]

Originally Posted by Endre2

So , in UK a Diesel car is CHEAPER in road tax and insurance than a petrol car ???
In the Netherlands it's just the other way round. Road tax for a Diesel car is double of that for a petrol car. Insurance for Diesel cars is also slightly higher. So is annual MOT.

Also, because of the high tax , the depreciation of Diesel cars is higher than petrol cars

Here is the information. It is not straightforward.

1. Overview
Vehicle tax rates are based on engine size, or fuel type and carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions, depending on when the vehicle was registered.

The rates are split into bands. The lower the emissions, the lower the vehicle tax.

https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-tax-rate-tables/overview

The above will change drastically in 2017, because the Tory chancellor is going to change the taxes for NEW cars manufactured after that date. This was brought in the last budget. The new rates are not retrospective but for the first 5 years for cars over £40,000 will cost another £310 per annum. Highlights are below. See note.

Insurance in the UK is quite complex with many factors taken into account, so there is generally no difference.

MOT is the same price.

Depreciation for UK diesels is generally considered to be lower. They tend to keep their price.

Notes
► New tax disc system from April 2017 for new cars
► Existing cars will use today's CO2 brackets
► From 2017 new cars pay 'standard' or 'premium' tax
► 95% of motorists will pay £140 a year 'standard rate'
► 'Premium' cars over £40,000 will carry a £310 supplement for five years
► Dirtiest cars to pay £2000 in first year
► New 'premium car tax' for vehicles over £40,000
► VED ring fenced to pay for new roads, repairs
► MOT tests only applicable after four years

Link....
http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-new...-uk-motorists/